View Full Version : Living after losing it all
In my quest to figure out what makes me happy, I am doing some volunteering. Yesterday, I had the pleasure of meeting an older woman who shared a wonderful story with me. I don't normally take quite so quick to someone but this woman was so open and such a pleasure. She felt like a soul sister by the time I left for home.
She was married for 28 years, dual income, 2 kids and very happy. Large home that was a monster to take care of but she felt grateful for having such a beautiful home but was completley miserable. She married very young (barely 18) and by the time she was 45, knew that her marriage was over and everything she thought she knew was suddenly upside down. Her husband was slowly bleeding them dry. He had a need to own the latest, greatest or spend massive amount on gifts or trips and would pay for it at any costs, including their marriage, their bank account, retirement and just for the sake of peace in the house. He spent over $240,000 in just 5 years. She knew it too and she blames herself for not doing something.
At 46, she divorced him and walked away- with just enough money to get through a few months and all she owned fit into her 1992 Nissan car. She had some pictures, some of the kids mementos, her clothes, her cat, some bedding and kitchen items and a will and drive to start living. She had to start her retirement over at 46 and figures she will just live modestly but happy for the rest of her life. She said the first week in the apartment, she was elated, second week, she spent getting sick to her stomach and praying for happiness. She sold her wedding band to have a clean break and build up her bank account and spent 4 days heavily sobbing about it. She thought she was losing her mind at one point and consulted everyone from the friends she had left, doctors, Jesus and horoscopes to help her deal with it all. It took her 6 months of intense realization and truth to come out the other side. She told me she woke up one day and she was just finally happy but she had to peel away all the layers and deal with them.
She never made much more than $35,000 a year at her job at the local school but she moved into a tiny apartment and started over, with nothing or so it seemed to the outside world. She had all she needed and most of all, she had her freedom. She wasn't tied to everyone else's schedule or needs and could do as she pleasel for the first time in her life. She told me she always enjoyed taking care of her kids because that's what mother's are supposed to do but when it came to her husband, she felt like his roommate more than his wife. She always felt in his way and just never had the courage to acknowledge the truth about her marriage early on. She is a devoted Christian but took issue with the people at her church who told her just to pray on it and divorce was not an option. She questioned her faith and people not understanding her, even going as ostracizing her once they knew of her pending divorce. She couldn't see remaining miserable for the sake of something she knew was never going to evolve.
I had the pleasure of meeting her for coffee at her apartment. She is the volunteer coordinator but likes to do the paper process at her home, so people feel more relaxed and she can get to know them. If ever I met another simple liver in life, she is the one. She spoke of slowing down in life to enjoy but getting onboard for the adventure. She has travelled domestically but loves to putter around our town and visit local haunts.
Her apartment was tiny, maybe 750 square feet. She had a simple red couch with a floor lamp and a chaise to read her library books in. A small circular table was in the corner, 3 chairs. She does all her own photography and had 2 huge pieces hanging in the room. Her bedroom was a double bed with a head board she made from a pallet (Swooooon) and a simple 3 drawer dresser. On top, pics of her kids and one of her zip lining (LOVE). And yes, I asked about her clothing. She has one small closet with all her clothing in it, neat, organized and just what she loves.
Her front and back porches had several potted plants and vegetables. She had just put in her spring flowers and they were so colorful and welcoming when I walked up.
I spent 5 hours with this woman, talking like we had been friends forever. She told me after she divorces, she bought nothing for an entire year, except for needs such as food and personal hygiene products. She eats simple meals and exercises every day. She told me she can't relate to the woman she was, even just a few years ago and her kids have commented that she seems much happier and in some strange way, has reversed aging. :)
She is my inspiration and I truly think people come into your life for a reason. She was open to showing me her whole life and answer all my questions. This woman is my shero of the year. She still has her moments, especially when something new or unexpected pops up in the life's path but she keeps going.
Just wanted to share because like her, I have been asking for help lately and this woman was put in MY path this week. :)
Wow. What a great share.
We never have to feel stuck.
We can always start from here and make changes to be who we are.
I actually ponder this scenario sometimes - starting over on my own. However, our culture is not kind to women of a certain age. I know quite a few women over 50 living this way but more often it was because their husbands left them.
What a celebration of life to share with us! Well done, MM.
Actually this is very similar to what many women have experienced after the death of their partner when debts exceeded assets and starting over is the only option.
May I share the idea of centripetal vs centrifugal thinking. Some who have gone through similar experiences keep the light that is their life shining down on themselves, their issues, hurts and memories (centripetal)vs those others who lift the light that is their life and shine it out to include the world and all its needs and opportunities to serve. (centrifugal).
I have two particular friends, one in each camp. The centripetal thinker seems to remember, recycle/rehearse every hurt from the past and remarks at how discourteous people seem to be to her. The centrifugal thinker is included in several families' events routinely, spends time with several individuals needing care even feeding one elderly man breakfast weekly and she is a delight to spend time with.
MamaM's sharing this story with us is centrifugal--thanks for the story, MamaM, and for the concept, razz.
Wonderful story and wonderful meaning. Thanks!
[QUOTE=MamaM;130619 She is a devoted Christian but took issue with the people at her church who told her just to pray on it and divorce was not an option. She questioned her faith and people not understanding her, even going as ostracizing her once they knew of her pending divorce. She couldn't see remaining miserable for the sake of something she knew was never going to evolve.[/QUOTE]
This thread would have been more appropriate over on the relationship board, but since it is here I'll bite.I don't know how she considers herself a devoted Christian.Having a husband who likes to spend is not an acceptable reason for a Christian to seek a divorce.And I'm sure that if her husband spent 240k over five years then she benefited from this also.Did it really take her 5 years to realize her husband had a spending issue? It sounds to me that she was just bored and wanted something new and exciting.There was no mention of marriage counseling. Shouldn't Christians atleast attempt to salvage a failing marriage.All of the non-believers out there can feel free to conduct themselves in any manner they see fit as long as it is law abiding.But if you are going to attend a church and call yourself a Christian, don't be suprised if your church peers hold you to a higher standard.
"our culture is not kind to women of a certain age". Being a man, could someone explain this to me. I sincerly do not understand this statement.
Nice story of acceptance and living the way one wants. Doing the math from your post, she does not seem older then mid 50s? Which made me seem old too :|(
CX3- I am not sure. I think she felt a little trapped and finally found her voice, maybe? I don't know her that well but I will delve into that. I think she felt like she was reaching out to her Church for help and they sorta told her to just deal with it. That can be quite a wake up call, maybe? I am not sure her exact angle on this, just that she felt abandoned to some extent by people she trusted.
Moderators- please feel free to move this if you like.
"our culture is not kind to women of a certain age". Being a man, could someone explain this to me. I sincerly do not understand this statement.
I'll let pinkytoe answer for herself, but in my experience, men are given more respect as they age, and often women are given less. There's a very subtle transition into invisibility when you are a woman of a certain age. I'm not feeling sorry for myself, and I don't accept the invisibility, but it is there. Increasingly I have found that I am not taken as seriously, I am referred to patronizingly as "young lady," and salespeople and servers almost look through me in a way they never did a decade or two ago.
I am NOT referring to a woman's own self-image. Women are as strong as they will themselves to be, and I consider myself to be as strong and capable as ever--if not moreso. I'm referring to the maddening, dismissive image cast on her by people who simply look on woman past a certain age as "over the hill." Men don't get that as much. I'm afraid it might have a lot to do with the same old stuff--the value placed on sex and money.
Thanks for the explanation catherine.That is kind of what I thought was meant by pinkytoe's comment. My son and I began watching some of the old James Bond movies recently. I can see the old attitudes towards women in those movies. But that was from past decades. I was under the impression that that kind of treatment of women was something of thw past.
I feel as a middle aged man that both older men and women are treated differently. I don't believe this is something that older women alone can exclusively claim.
I don't know how she considers herself a devoted Christian.Having a husband who likes to spend is not an acceptable reason for a Christian to seek a divorce.And I'm sure that if her husband spent 240k over five years then she benefited from this also.Did it really take her 5 years to realize her husband had a spending issue? It sounds to me that she was just bored and wanted something new and exciting.There was no mention of marriage counseling. Shouldn't Christians atleast attempt to salvage a failing marriage.All of the non-believers out there can feel free to conduct themselves in any manner they see fit as long as it is law abiding.But if you are going to attend a church and call yourself a Christian, don't be suprised if your church peers hold you to a higher standard.
cx3, all we know of the situation is what MamaM has told us. There likely are some details missing. Maybe there were other problems. Maybe they tried counseling. The outcome of counseling is not always keeping a marriage together (if someone believes it is, that's not counseling, that's just "re-education").
As for the "higher standard", I'm not sure what that would be (and I say that as a recovered ex-Christian).
Much of the Christian religion depends on one's interpretation of God and the gospel. There are Christian groups which feel that speaking in tongues is a manifestation of the Spirit. There are Christian groups which believe in the baptism of children and others that do not recognize that baptism.
Many Christian churches would allow a married person to divorce a mate who has violated the marriage vows with a physical affair. What about those whose mates have had emotional affairs? Are affairs a matter of which specific body parts were involved? What about cases where maybe the couple shouldn't have married in the first place? If marriage is indeed a gift of God, should it be accepted and used the way so many do by being ignored at best and abused at worst? I was in such a marriage. Looked fine on paper; behind the front door, not so much. Do we really honor God's gift by maintaining a lie (and the marriage) when the love is gone and there's no expectation of it coming back? And, yes, I lost people whom I thought were good friends after the divorce. Interesting tidbit: divorce is as prevalent in Red states as it is in Blue states. Huh.
When a "higher standard" can be determined by the world's Christian sects, I think it could be applied. But I don't anticipate that ever happening.
I actually ponder this scenario sometimes - starting over on my own. However, our culture is not kind to women of a certain age. I know quite a few women over 50 living this way but more often it was because their husbands left them.
This confused me some, too. I've lived on my own all my adult life and while it's true men aren't lining up to flirt with me now that I'm a gimpy-kneed geezer, and also true that old people in general aren't exactly celebrated in our culture, I'm not feeling the unkindness. This could be because I'm an oblivious introvert, but I bet there's a healthy cohort of independent old women out there who share my contentment.
ApatheticNoMore
2-26-13, 4:56pm
I don't know if I think older women are any more discriminated against than older men (except in dating), though I agree older people of both sexes are viewed as less valuable than younger people in general in this society.
But the idea of a middle age woman leaving a marriage of many years just out of boredom and wanting something new and exciting also strikes me as completely implausible (I mean maybe if she was cheating and had someone in mind, but otherwise - beyond absurd). Of course leaving because it's making you miserable is another matter.
I also think of course there are situations where a woman will find themselves much worse off from the divorce than the man and not just in future dating although in that too, but if for instance he built a career and she stayed home with the kids. Yea it's not difficult to see who comes out ahead financially from that one.
Again,I don't feel this thread belongs on this forum.
I appreciate the contributions SteveinMN makes here on the personal finance forum.I don't want to diminish that appreciation by commenting on this non-financial subject any further.
Again,I don't feel this thread belongs on this forum.
I appreciate the contributions SteveinMN makes here on the personal finance forum.I don't want to diminish that appreciation by commenting on this non-financial subject any further.
Good call, I'd say.
Thank you, cx3. My response was off-topic here. Whether the woman in the original post ended up starting over for reasons which could be considered "Biblical" or not, she is starting over and has found a way to live simply and happily that has inspired MamaM. It's encouraging!
I'd be happy to continue the discussion in a more appropriate forum.
I'm glad that she was able to create the life she wanted for herself. That's awesome. :)
Also, I know lots of devout christians (and catholics) who are divorced. Just because they are doesn't mean that they didn't put in the effort to save the marriage or make it work.
Most churches have some measure of allowances for people to dissolve marriages. Some are more strict than othes. None of us are or were on the inside -- of her marriage, her faith, or her church. I feel it's harsh to assume she was simply "bored and wanted out." It could be that there was a lot more going on there than we will ever know or understand. As such, I think it's enough to accept that she went through a struggle with this, and ultimately came out in a happier, healthier place for her.
I think that this is about finances, along with the other issues, of course.
One year and five days ago I fled my 45 year marriage. I barely survived that day, leaving with my purse and the clothes I was wearing. Two months later, after living in a domestic violence shelter, my ex was ordered out of the house and I returned to find that he had neglected our cats, one of which died. Whilst I was in the shelter and under protective orders, he gutted the house and our investments. I spent six weeks clearing the house of his hoarding, making repairs as I could and selling the house in five days for cash. At our final hearing in August he presented an insane list of expenses that I could not dispute unless I wanted to delay the final decree. He knew this and I paid all of that bogus stuff out of my half of the proceeds from the house.
Today I am still waiting for him to comply with even one of the court orders. Waiting is disingenuous, because the chances are excellent that he has successfully hidden nearly every cent. I am now, at age 66 looking for a job where the physical disabilities that forced me to retire at age 61 will allow me to earn enough to live.
So, yeah, I have survived and whatever my life is, well, it is exponentially better than being dead, and anyone can toss in any of the other issues, but this kind of circumstance is about the financial aspects more than anything else.
I will say that this woman--who really does sound like a role model--didn't come close to losing everything, IMO. She has a reliable job/income, her health, relationships in the community, and clarity--it seems--about who she is and what she wants in life. $35,000 a year is certainly enough for a comfortable modest life, and since she has a work history she can look forward to Social Security (and maybe a pension?) to sustain her when she retires.
My widowed grandmother was my role model. She lived alone for many years, enjoying the freedom to come and go as she liked (lots of meetings of the garden club, the glass collectors' club, luncheons with the ladies) and rattled around in the big house where she raised her big family. She had no interest in dating and never once complained about wanting for anything. (Of course I didn't know she was my role model at the time.) Another early influence was my very favorite children's book in which a spinster lived in a little house overlooking the Bay of Fundy with her cats. She supplemented her income making quilts and selling them.
"It sounds to me that she was just bored and wanted something new and exciting." (cx3)
It sounded to me like she wanted a different, perhaps more peaceful and/or congruent life. That may be considered sinful in some circles, I guess. And we don't know how her husband felt; maybe he was relieved at the turn of events.
Wow Jilly..you are inspiring as well!!!
I think the financial aspect she hit upon was that she was left with practically nothing, money wise, and is still living, happily. She knows she will neverhave what she had in the bank and she is at peace with that. I just find inspiration in that. :)
Wow, what an inspiring story and glimpse into someone else's simple life and the path it took them to get there! Thanks for posting, MamaM. And I have to agree, you are inspiring as well, Jilly.
My salary is almost the same as the woman in the original post but I live more like how she describes her earlier, married life. However, while I am very happily married to a mostly frugal spouse, you never know what curve balls life may throw at you and it is comforting to see an example of someone who has started over and forged a simple, happy life on what I make.
I am not inspiring, just lucky. If I am anything, it is a cautionary tale.
Jilly,
I'm thankful that you are safe.
Ha ha, to me this scenario isn't amazing - it's just how hubby and I live - though we have even less space, and a big cat who rules the roost and wonders (I suspect) why it is we're sleeping on HER bed, lol!
I'm about the same age as the friend you speak of...I never had to start over from a well-padded marital situation, but I did suffer a big lifestyle-derail as a young person when I left the parental home. Folks had big house, new cars, plenty o'trips, redecoration every couple years. I'll never forget the color of the shag carpet in the rec room - Grecian Gold, according to Mrs. Alger, our decorator. It was important to my parents to have a decorator...Hey, I loved it too! I had a lavender bedroom one year, a mint green one the next. New frilly bedspread with matching curtains.
So it's been a come-down. What's so hard is to re-work what I think of as prosperity and affluence. I realized the other day that my income combined with my hubby's now qualifies us for inclusion in the middle class, according to most measures, but we're still stretched and living like students. What's the difference?
My dad at his earning peak was making $60K a year, and that was in 1975 or so. What does that work out to - maybe $200k in today's dollars? But they spent it all, and died in debt.
My parents wanted to look prosperous, so they lived on credit. It apparently wasn't important to them to actually HAVE wealth, only to appear as if they did.
In short, they were renting their lives.
I don't want to do that. The thing is, nowadays it's hard to have all the appurtenances even with a great salary. The key is not spending all of it. This has been a hard lesson for me to learn, because I would love to have more comfort - a bigger living space, great furniture, blah blah blah.
Somebody said, you can either look like you're wealthy, or have actual wealth. Most people can't afford both.
I'm pursuing real wealth. I may never achieve affluence, but I don't want to die broke. I do miss having a lovely home though. That's one thing that's been difficult for me as I pursue financial discipline - and I think it's behind why I've become addicted to treating myself with smaller purchases. I know I'll never achieve the lifestyle my parents had - though it was pretty much a house of cards.
Thanks for the thought-provoking post!
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