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CaseyMiller
3-17-13, 10:16pm
On a road trip today with the family. Wearing the bluetooth HS of course. Smart phone is playing my favorite songs that no one else in the car has to listen to. The music would cut out long enough for the phone to speak turn-by-turn directions to me. I'm able to receive texts and reply to them without touching the phone. During the trip I have immediate access to all local business info I need (e.g. hours, addresses, reviews etc..). Keeping track of friends and family thru social networks.

All of this is mind blowing to me. It enables such freedom of movement.

I was at a party a few nights ago. A gentlemen asked directions how to get out of the neighborhood. Almost simultaneously three people asked, somewhat impatiently, why the person just didn't use the GPS on their smart phone. Already, this technology is so mainstream, people are losing patience with those that do not use it. Kind of like standing in line behind someone still writing a check.

Tradd
3-17-13, 10:45pm
I actually know a number of people who don't have a smartphone, yet do have a GPS unit in their car.

Jilly
3-17-13, 11:03pm
I can appreciate all of that, I even know what most of that is, although I am still navigating by the stars. :|(

Dhiana
3-18-13, 1:01am
It enables such freedom of movement.


+10 In a country that doesn't name their streets it's a huge time saver!!

bae
3-18-13, 1:50am
Weird. I went on a car trip today with the family, on an island where there is no cell coverage. We...talked....to each other on the drive. When we reached our destination, we met up with 20-30 other people, and played music with hand-held instruments made of wood and metal for a couple hours. Then navigated to the nearby village by looking at where the sun was, sat around and had snacks and coffee and chatted with other village residents, and played some more music and sang.

Then we drove back, also by sun position, and headed home to our own island.

Go go technology!

Wildflower
3-18-13, 2:27am
On a road trip today with the family. Wearing the bluetooth HS of course. Smart phone is playing my favorite songs that no one else in the car has to listen to. The music would cut out long enough for the phone to speak turn-by-turn directions to me. I'm able to receive texts and reply to them without touching the phone. During the trip I have immediate access to all local business info I need (e.g. hours, addresses, reviews etc..). Keeping track of friends and family thru social networks.

All of this is mind blowing to me. It enables such freedom of movement.

I was at a party a few nights ago. A gentlemen asked directions how to get out of the neighborhood. Almost simultaneously three people asked, somewhat impatiently, why the person just didn't use the GPS on their smart phone. Already, this technology is so mainstream, people are losing patience with those that do not use it. Kind of like standing in line behind someone still writing a check.

I just find it sad. I like having conversations with real people in real life. It amazes me how so many are just so completely absorbed with their damn phone, facebook, etc. these days. They are missing out on so much in life, in my opinion...

Zoebird
3-18-13, 3:51am
I have to say that there is a balance with technology that you can have.

For example, I love to go on drives by myself, listen to music or just have some quiet. THat's nice. When it's family in the car, we usually chat or have some quiet time or listen to music together. Sometimes books on tape.

But, sometimes, I use my phone and call an aunt or friend in the US to chat for the duration of the drive, which is really great.

In terms of navigation, I can use my google maps combined with the sun or a compass, and find my way around. I actually am so-so at orienteering. We do a fun family activity with that here in wellington for that. :)

anyway. . . you can enjoy the best of both worlds, you know?

herbgeek
3-18-13, 6:19am
What happened to keeping track of friends and family by actually talking to them? Particularly when they are in the car with you. Some of my fondest memories as a kid were the games we played in the car on long trips. Now everyone is plugged in individually so they aren't inconvenienced by having to participate in something not of their own choosing. I love technology as much or more than the next person, I just don't think all aspects of it are positive, and the disconnection with the people you are with to connect to the people you aren't with is one of those.

Float On
3-18-13, 7:35am
I can tell you that my teen boys have thanked us several times for being a bit 'old-school'. They are fed up with their friends and their attachments to their phones.
I plan my route before I take off with google maps and sometimes a wrong turn is just a way to discover something neat.

catherine
3-18-13, 8:05am
I am really in favor of technology and I think it's been a huge advance--as big as the Bronze Age. I think back to my days as a secretary, trained by the top gun--Katharine Gibbs. We had to use three sheets of carbon paper when we typed a letter--those messy carbons were our copies. No Xerox (yikes, am I REALLY showing my age). If you made a mistake, a small typo, you had to carefully erase the one mistake on all three carbons. Then you had to line the platen up really carefully so that when you retyped the character it would be perfect and no one would be able to tell it had been a mistake. If you made three mistakes in the letter, you had to tear it out and start all over.

Then you get the one letter or memo finally typed and you have to wait to get your boss to sign it, and then you either have to put it in a envelope and mail it (later I often had to run to catch the UPS truck, but we didn't have UPS back then either), or copy it and walk it around to all the different people's desks.

That is just ONE example of how times have changed. While I'm sure we have tons and tons of useless drivel because it's so easy to produce words, and now pictures, too, I still think it's a marvel.

And GPS! I'm a map lover. I could stare at them all day. As a result, I have TWO GPSs--one in my car and the one on phone, and sometimes I'll check one against the other. As Casey said, no more getting directions and worrying if you heard people right, and what if you forget the directions to the wedding in the house and you're on your way, and .. boy GPS has eliminated a lot of stress, too. Dark side of GPS: Did you see the 60 minutes piece on the family whose GPS got them lost in Death Valley?? That was more than a little scary.

catherine
3-18-13, 8:12am
Weird. I went on a car trip today with the family, on an island where there is no cell coverage. We...talked....to each other on the drive. When we reached our destination, we met up with 20-30 other people, and played music with hand-held instruments made of wood and metal for a couple hours. Then navigated to the nearby village by looking at where the sun was, sat around and had snacks and coffee and chatted with other village residents, and played some more music and sang.

Then we drove back, also by sun position, and headed home to our own island.

Go go technology!

Well, I have to say, that does sound quite wonderful

peggy
3-18-13, 8:53am
Weird. I went on a car trip today with the family, on an island where there is no cell coverage. We...talked....to each other on the drive. When we reached our destination, we met up with 20-30 other people, and played music with hand-held instruments made of wood and metal for a couple hours. Then navigated to the nearby village by looking at where the sun was, sat around and had snacks and coffee and chatted with other village residents, and played some more music and sang.

Then we drove back, also by sun position, and headed home to our own island.

Go go technology!

Neanderthal!

Gregg
3-18-13, 9:44am
I now use my smart phone for everything CaseyMiller does and more, but it takes nothing away from family time, jam (as in music) time or anything else. Smart phones are the future. Some will adapt, some will resist, but it won't change the trend. I don't think its necessarily a good thing, but I am convinced we are at the beginning of a stage where people are going to live their lives on the phone. Philosophical arguments aside, its pretty cool that I can deposit a check simply by taking a picture of it, automate my grocery list according to what's on sale this week, turn up my thermostat at home before I get there, tune my guitar, receive whole photo albums from friends, unlock my car door if I lock the keys in it, monitor my heart rate...

pinkytoe
3-18-13, 10:37am
I am still navigating by the stars
It makes me very sad that so many are mesmerized by technology and might forget the enchantment of nature.

jp1
3-18-13, 10:39am
Weird. I went on a car trip today with the family, on an island where there is no cell coverage. We...talked....to each other on the drive. When we reached our destination, we met up with 20-30 other people, and played music with hand-held instruments made of wood and metal for a couple hours. Then navigated to the nearby village by looking at where the sun was, sat around and had snacks and coffee and chatted with other village residents, and played some more music and sang.

Then we drove back, also by sun position, and headed home to our own island.

Go go technology!

You didn't use horse and buggy to get there? :-)

But seriously, I say that for a reason. We all use some technology in our lives. We can argue all day about whether something is "good" technology that does something useful or "bad" technology that serves no useful purpose. Being individual people, though, we will each find different technologies to be more or less useful to us, either through trying them and finding or not finding them useful, or just by making a decision not to get something based on the functions it does. We gave my grandmother a microwave 30 years ago and she was absolutely certain she didn't need or want it. Once she finally did try it out and realized it could save her a lot of effort when reheating large quantities of leftovers during family visits she quickly came to love it.

puglogic
3-18-13, 10:56am
I love and admire technology greatly. After all, I make my living at it. I appreciate what it can do for me.

But I see people -- nearly everyone, really --- becoming so reliant on it that they can no longer be satisfied with a simple human conversation, with reading a real paper book (one at a time), with walking/biking where I can walk/bike, with learning how to use those archaic things called "maps," and leaving the televisions and smart phones at home. My next door neighbor drives her car to the yoga class which is held a three minute walk away. She can't read a map and so has to have GPS for the smallest journeys. She can't afford her mortgage but she can "afford" a $200/month cable package and an iPhone. And she's very typical. It's gotten ridiculous.

I am grateful for technology. But I do not worship it. And if tomorrow the grid went kaboom and we had no smart phones, no cable, no TVs in the car, no mind blowing technology, I know I'd be just as happy and just as able to meet the challenges of living. I can't say that for the majority of people I know who rely on it.

An amusing read on the topic is Super Sad True Love Story by Gary Shteyngart. It's disturbing on so many levels (ignore the love story part...it's the cancerous technology storyline that's interesting)

Gregg
3-18-13, 11:19am
Technology can enhance life or be used at the expense of it. The only variable is the user. If you are not in control of your alcohol use its logical to limit or eliminate your drinking. If technology threatens your chosen lifestyle rather than enhancing it, don't use it. Its easy for my generation to watch kids texting each other 4,000 times a month and believe that because we learned to communicate with our voice rather than our key pad our method is somehow superior. Well, says who? Ask the kids and a lot of them would probably tell you texting is superior. I prefer conversation to be in reasonably complete sentences and by voice when possible, but that doesn't make my method any better than any other. Their preference is just as valid as my own and when you get right down to it, their method is pretty efficient. For the record, we end up with a whole lot of high school age dinner guests in an average week. The rule is no phones at the table because we do believe it is important for them to be comfortable with human interaction, but I haven't noticed that any of these kids are reduced because they prefer to communicate electronically. Shoot, my Dad hated Led Zeppelin the first thousand times he heard them... Times change.

JaneV2.0
3-18-13, 11:34am
I never did learn to love my microwave, so after a couple of years I passed it along to a friend.

Like CaseyMiller, I marvel at the technology that allows us to carry a telephone, videophone, mail service, stereo, radio, bookstore, encyclopedia, thesaurus, translator, GPS, police scanner, notepad, camera, photo album, game system, security system...(really, there's no end to it) along with us in a package small enough to put in a pocket or messenger bag. Especially as I'm old enough to remember when home entertainment meant monaural radio in a free-standing unit the size of a washing machine--or your aunt playing the piano.

It's not like it's one or the other--you can use your GPS to get to the forest and do some geocaching, after all, taking pictures of flora and fauna to email or save. (Was that a sasquatch? The shot's all blurry!) And on your way home check ratings on restaurants nearby for a tasty meal and conversation. I don't see much to criticize in the technology itself, but people who can't put their smart device down long enough to drive are in another class altogether.

SteveinMN
3-18-13, 11:38am
Technology can enhance life or be used at the expense of it. The only variable is the user. If you are not in control of your alcohol use its logical to limit or eliminate your drinking. If technology threatens your chosen lifestyle rather than enhancing it, don't use it.
Exactly. Technology is just a vector. The same bae that enjoys a completely "analog" outing with friends counts on much more technology to find out about and fight a fire. No harm, no foul. There are no prizes for those who completely shun modern technology or for those who are so buried in it that they are truly handicapped when the lights go out. But, again, that's up to the "wetware" (the human), not the hardware and software.

SiouzQ.
3-18-13, 8:49pm
I love paper maps, you know the kind that are really hard to fold back up in the car while you are driving? I've always found them to be quite romantic, and I will pour over them while planning my road trips, idly looking at all the tiny funky little towns with weird names along some way-out-of-the way route from Point A to Point B. My best thinking/relaxing/recharging comes from choosing, not necessarily the quickest way to someplace, but the most interesting. I like to be surprised by what I come across, like the tiny BBQ joint in the middle of nowhere Texas where I had a nice conversation with the proprietor over a homemade BBQ pork sandwich, or the crazy metal sculpture dude ranch somewhere in Kansas. I like to come to a fork in the road and have to decide on the fly whether to go right or left. THAT is adventure and it is what I save up my money for. If I were to buy a smart phone or a new computer or have cable TV, I wouldn't be able to do my kind of adventuring, so for me it is simple. I try to keep things as least complicated as possible with the least amount of technology I can get a way with, though I know I am falling farther and farther behind the rest of society in my skill set...my life, as it is, has no use for a Smart Phone. Period.

JaneV2.0
3-18-13, 9:36pm
Yeah, "adventure" in my crowd is a synonym for "hopelessly lost." I don't currently have a smart phone or GPS, but if I ever ride out into the sunset again, I certainly will.

SteveinMN
3-18-13, 9:57pm
SQ, some of my favorite vacations have been the ones where I filled up the car and pointed it in one direction and drove. Never knew what you'd find -- sometimes some really charming places and beautiful scenes. I never switched on the GPS even though I had one with me.

jp1
3-18-13, 10:11pm
I think you all are underestimating GPS's ability to deliver on the adventure front. About a year ago I was driving from one meeting to another in Fresno, a city I don't know at all. I put in the address of my next meeting and dutifully followed her advice until she said "arriving at, destination, on left!" On my left was a farmhouse surrounded by grape vines on one side and some cows on the other. It turned out that she didn't know the difference between north 6th street and south 6th street so I was about 20 miles away from where I needed to be. Since I'd missed my appointment I had time to stop for lunch before my next meeting. I had a delicious lunch from a taco truck at the next corner, along with a whole bunch of migrant workers, with me the only person they'd seen all day wearing a suit and tie...

Gregg
3-19-13, 9:40am
The differences in attitude toward technology are fascinating. It appears some people feel its an intrusion into their quest for simplicity that they would rather avoid when possible. On the other side, where I am, the very purpose of using the technology is to simplify life. I have a smart phone because it replaces about a dozen other small appliances, it consolidates a huge pool of resources and it puts any information I desire in a package that fits nicely in my pocket. Talk about decluttering! Obviously there is no right or wrong, only what's right for you, but it is really interesting to see the differences in the group.

puglogic
3-19-13, 10:13am
I think one source of irritation with me is what was mentioned somewhere above, that the use of certain technologies is becoming an expectation. I still have certain people who feel slighted if I don't return an email or answer my phone at any time of the day, because don't I have a smart phone on my body constantly like they do? And asking for directions to a location is sometimes met with, "Well, just plug this address into your GPS..." Some technology-smitten people tend to forget that not everyone is interested in that level of saturation, and I detest getting the old "Stink Eye" because I don't choose what they've chosen. Amusing sometimes, irritating others.

The acquisition of new technology, for me, is based on a couple of factors: 1) Will the cost of purchasing, powering, and maintaining it significantly improve my quality of life or profitability of my business? and 2) Will it improve or erode my ability to function & be happy in the difficult future that's ahead?

pinkytoe
3-19-13, 10:23am
I don't find having technology makes my life any simpler - just must faster and more efficient. And with more expectations all the way around. More is less?
The one thing I often ponder is what exactly did I do with my time before I spent surfing the web, checking email, visiting forums, etc. for sometimes hours a day.
I don't remember. The addictive quality of it scares me a bit.

JaneV2.0
3-19-13, 11:46am
I think one source of irritation with me is what was mentioned somewhere above, that the use of certain technologies is becoming an expectation. I still have certain people who feel slighted if I don't return an email or answer my phone at any time of the day, because don't I have a smart phone on my body constantly like they do? ...

A hundred years ago, people weren't expected to provide phone numbers; now they are. It's come full circle for me--I don't take phone calls, but prefer email and use my cell as a pager.

I used to spend hours a day reading. I still do, but much of it involves a screen now.

bae
3-19-13, 12:48pm
The same bae that enjoys a completely "analog" outing with friends counts on much more technology to find out about and fight a fire.


To be fair, most of what we use in firefighting would be quite familiar to firefighters 100 years ago: axes, water, hoses, pikes. What has advanced is understanding of health issues, so we now have an extra 30 pounds of breathing gear to carry to protect our lungs, and more understanding of organization/command issues, so we can act more effectively, more safely. There is some advanced technology in play - radios to coordinate activity, thermal imaging cameras to use when verifying a structure is done burning, medical technologies and protocols, foaming agents so you don't have to use so much water, and a few other odds-and-ends.

But it's essentially still muscle, sweat, and hand tools.

That said, I have no real concerns with technology, being used appropriately and tastefully. Alas, so many people I see these days use it to isolate themselves from other people sitting right next to them, to the harm of community.

http://talesofextraordinarysanity.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/epic-fail-photos-family-dinner-fail.jpg?w=500&h=375

Spartana
3-19-13, 2:31pm
To be fair, most of what we use in firefighting would be quite familiar to firefighters 100 years ago: axes, water, hoses, pikes. What has advanced is understanding of health issues, so we now have an extra 30 pounds of breathing gear to carry to protect our lungs, and more understanding of organization/command issues, so we can act more effectively, more safely. There is some advanced technology in play - radios to coordinate activity, thermal imaging cameras to use when verifying a structure is done burning, medical technologies and protocols, foaming agents so you don't have to use so much water, and a few other odds-and-ends.

But it's essentially still muscle, sweat, and hand tools.

That said, I have no real concerns with technology, being used appropriately and tastefully. Alas, so many people I see these days use it to isolate themselves from other people sitting right next to them, to the harm of community.


Ha Ha - Yeah me with a firehose. Low tech all the way ;-)!

While I am low tech on a personal level for many of the reasons other's have mentioned, I also find technolgy mind blowing. Just because you choose not to use it (or even learn a lot of the functions that come with new tech) doesn't mean you can be impressed by it. I find my life more pleasant and enjoyable (and quiet!) the less tech I have it in even if it's a bit more cumbersome to do without it. I actually go far far out of my way to try to avoid being connected rather then trying to be more connected.

ETA: BTW Bae - I'm very impressed that you are doing all that firefighter training at your "old advanced age" of 40 :D It's a lot of hard work and makes me tired just thinking about having to do it all again. Kudos to you - you are an inspiration!!

decemberlov
3-19-13, 2:51pm
I love paper maps, you know the kind that are really hard to fold back up in the car while you are driving? I've always found them to be quite romantic, and I will pour over them while planning my road trips, idly looking at all the tiny funky little towns with weird names along some way-out-of-the way route from Point A to Point B. My best thinking/relaxing/recharging comes from choosing, not necessarily the quickest way to someplace, but the most interesting. I like to be surprised by what I come across, like the tiny BBQ joint in the middle of nowhere Texas where I had a nice conversation with the proprietor over a homemade BBQ pork sandwich, or the crazy metal sculpture dude ranch somewhere in Kansas. I like to come to a fork in the road and have to decide on the fly whether to go right or left. THAT is adventure and it is what I save up my money for. If I were to buy a smart phone or a new computer or have cable TV, I wouldn't be able to do my kind of adventuring, so for me it is simple. I try to keep things as least complicated as possible with the least amount of technology I can get a way with, though I know I am falling farther and farther behind the rest of society in my skill set...my life, as it is, has no use for a Smart Phone. Period.

couldn't have said it better :)

Miss Cellane
3-19-13, 3:11pm
As someone said upthread, there's a balance. I just think that balance is going to be different for everyone.

I'd love a smartphone. But the frugal side of me can't justify the expense of a data plan, not when I have a $20 phone bill. I'd love an iPad, but again, can't justify the cost. Maybe, when this old desktop dies, I'll get an iPad or something similar to replace the desktop, because in 2 or 3 more years, the iPad will be doing things we can't imagine now.

I have a GPS. I can read maps, but I love the GPS. Because I'm usually alone in the car and when I'm driving to someplace I've never been, the GPS gives me a heads-up warning that the street I need to turn down is coming up, and I can see the view screen without moving my head too much. With a paper map, I was constantly having to take my eyes off the road and focus on the map to see where I was and where the next turn would be. Much, much safer, for me and everyone else on the road, for me to have the GPS.

Spellchecker. Well, I'm dyslexic. There are times I think Spellcheck saved my life in grad school.

My nephew had spine surgery last month. Even while he was still in ICU, he could Facetime with his brother and sister to let them know he was okay. And now that he's recuperating at home, he's got Netflix and his computer and his XBox and his Wii to keep him occupied (and help keep my poor, dear sister-in-law from going insane). He's a quadriplegic. He can't hold cards to play card games, he can't pick up dice to roll them, he can't move a playing piece across a game board. But with the right equipment, he can go online and play games against able bodied kids his age, and win. He can use a computer. He's got a power wheelchair that he steers with a joy stick.

He takes that wheelchair out on the 10 acres of land his family owns and drives the paths that his dad mows for him every summer. He gets his gang of friends out there and they play war, with my nephew as chief strategist because he loves to watch old war movies. Despite the fact that holding heavy books is difficult, he has powered his way through the Harry Potter books, the Narnia chronicles and is starting in on The Hobbit. (He actually finds a Kindle harder to use.) He goes swimming, in a special pool, weekly. He's a pretty talented artist, with the proper adaptive equipment. His love of, and need for, technology does not infringe on his relationships, his love of nature or desire to read.

Let's face it. On a very basic level, the wheel, the inclined plane and the screw are all technology. I'm sure some people decried the invention of the telephone because people would stay in their homes and not go out to visit as much.

What we have to do, as individuals, is figure out how to use technology to meet our goals. Not make the use of technology the goal.

Gardenarian
3-19-13, 3:42pm
I find the new technology sparkly, exciting, confusing, stupid, time-wasting, and extremely expensive.

In a lot of ways, the internet is the new TV - primarily, an unhealthy way of killing time while putting yourself at the mercy of advertisers. (And worse, wireless providers.)

Some day there will be a simple and cheap device that has everything I want. I can wait.

puglogic
3-19-13, 7:22pm
I love all the opinions here too. Bravo, Miss Cellane.

Zoebird
3-20-13, 5:32am
What happened to keeping track of friends and family by actually talking to them? Particularly when they are in the car with you. Some of my fondest memories as a kid were the games we played in the car on long trips. Now everyone is plugged in individually so they aren't inconvenienced by having to participate in something not of their own choosing. I love technology as much or more than the next person, I just don't think all aspects of it are positive, and the disconnection with the people you are with to connect to the people you aren't with is one of those.

Other than my husband and son -- with whom I do converse a great deal daily -- the only way for me to talk with family is via technology. I can use a phone or the internet. Those are my options. This is partly why I love facebook and facetime and skype and the like so much. It really does keep us in touch, and we do get to "talk" with each other. If I didn't have this technology -- well, the first europeans here got letters every 4-6 months. It took a long-ass time for stuff to get here.

So, you know what? I'll take it. :D

oldhat
3-20-13, 10:14am
For my lifestyle at least, technology is a boon to simple living. One of my projects over the next year or so is to digitize every possible piece of paper in my life so I can store all my documents on my laptop, with a backup in the cloud. But I'm also very conservative in my adoption of new technology. I didn't get a cell phone until 2007, and I still don't have a smartphone. Since I've gotten rid of most of my books, I thought that an e-reader might be useful, but I've held off on that because I didn't think the technology was mature (although this new Kindle Paperwhite looks like it might finally meet the bill). When I toyed with the idea of getting a GPS, I realized that I'd use it maybe once a month, so I just download directions to wherever I'm going.

Of course technology has its down side. Like TV, the Internet consists mostly of useless crap, but what's useful about it is very useful indeed. And it's certainly true that technology can serve to isolate people from each other. For example, I believe that people have gone too far in letting technology entertain them rather than figuring out ways to entertain themselves. That's why I'm learning to play the guitar.

pinkytoe
3-20-13, 10:25am
I predict there will be a lot of sore necks in a decade or so:).

catherine
3-20-13, 10:48am
For my lifestyle at least, technology is a boon to simple living. One of my projects over the next year or so is to digitize every possible piece of paper in my life so I can store all my documents on my laptop, with a backup in the cloud.

I agree--BUT I still feel that really important documents should never be destroyed just because they're in the Cloud or even on your hard drive. What happens when the technology is no longer accessible for some reason--cyberterrorism, or just technological obsolescence. I still have our family videos on VHS and I keep bugging my husband (a video editor) to put them on DVD or a pocket hard drive. What good are the videos when all the VHS recorders are in the landfill? What good are your family photos, marriage license, etc. if your hard drive crashes?

SteveinMN
3-20-13, 12:06pm
What good are the videos when all the VHS recorders are in the landfill? What good are your family photos, marriage license, etc. if your hard drive crashes?
oldhat did mention that (s)he backs up his/her data to "the cloud". I was about to pull out that statement as a quote by itself and applaud it because most people are not prescient enough to realize that they really should have more than one copy of the important stuff. Or even the contacts list on their phone (smart or "dumb").

My concern (as a former IT guy) is whose cloud it is, both on the basis of who can access the data besides the nominal owner (and for what purposes) and on the basis of the owner's access to it if the provider goes belly-up, etc. I trust some clouds more than others. But that's a separate conversation.

And it's not like low-tech is without its risks. All those family photos in an album? They can be lost to a fire or flood, with no replacements available. Inks and photographic dyes can go off-color or even fade away. Maybe you can apply to your county of marriage for a replacement marriage license, but how many people hold the negatives to their family pictures?

It's that same double-edged sword of technology we've been discussing for a while now.

catherine
3-20-13, 12:12pm
No, you're right, Steve.. I did catch oldhat's hard drive PLUS cloud reference (and I totally agree), but there's still another layer of inaccessibility and that is, if you don't see it, does it exist? In other words, I just recently put together a fairly extensive spreadsheet for my kids in the event of my death, because there is so much "stuff" out there in cyberspace. Even if they knew it was there, would they know how to access it? So I've got user names and pass codes for everything from bank accounts to log-ins and passwords for hobbies like ancestry.com and my blog and my credit cards.. etc. etc. including my username/password for this forum.

It's not like, if I die, the kids will go through my desk drawers and say, "oh, I didn't know Mom had this!"--because there will be nothing for them to "touch" unless I tell them--and let them know how to get at it.

Amaranth
3-20-13, 1:22pm
People in situations similar to CaseyMiller's might give a quick thought to whether the person asking the question might know perfectly well how to get out of the neighborhood, but might be trying to seeing if someone they were interested in knowing further might indicate their interest by volunteering to go outside and point out how to get somewhere. This might lead to a better chance to ask for a phone number, etc.

oldhat
3-20-13, 2:28pm
I agree--BUT I still feel that really important documents should never be destroyed just because they're in the Cloud or even on your hard drive.

I am planning to keep some paper documents, of course--passport, birth certificate, recent tax returns, etc. (although everyone should make digital copies of those as well). But digitizing is a feasible strategy for me for a number of reasons. First off, I back up everything nine ways from Sunday. In addition to cloud backup of important files, I do a weekly "image" of my laptop hard drive on to a 500GB flash drive. That's a complete copy of everything, including programs, which can be reinstalled in case of a hard drive crash. I also back up important files on to an 8GB flash drive that's attached to my key chain.

Second, I don't really have all that many digital files whose loss I would consider catastrophic. I have personal writings, mostly in the form of journals, old letters, and a few dozen photos with particular sentimental value, in addition to business and medical docs. All told, I doubt I'll ever fill up the 8 gigs of storage that I carry around in my pocket. I couldn't fill up my 500GB drive in 10 lifetimes

A tremendous number of what most people would consider their "essential" documents are being backed up for them already by someone else. For example, my credit card statements are backed up by my credit card company. I can access and print out anything from the last 18 months for free, and anything farther back than that for a small fee. This is true of bank statements, mutual fund statements, and the like.

It is true that you have to be wary of technology shifts. Not long ago I decided to get rid of all my old floppy disks, and so I loaded them on to my laptop. Then I realized almost all these docs had been written using WordPerfect, and Microsoft Word could read them only with difficulty and the formatting is all messed up. But they are still readable and could be reformatted with some work, and I doubt this kind of thing is going to be as much of a problem going forward.

SteveinMN
3-20-13, 5:32pm
It's not like, if I die, the kids will go through my desk drawers and say, "oh, I didn't know Mom had this!"--because there will be nothing for them to "touch" unless I tell them--and let them know how to get at it.
That's a fair point. Much of the need to do this falls into the "Are your affairs in order?" thread elsewhere on this site. I, too, have a document on my laptop's desktop (no searching; obvious title) that has the kind of information you've recorded for your kids, as well as the locations of backups, etc. It is a requirement of the digital age, IMHO.