View Full Version : what to do, son, cell phone and dad
sigh, this is crappy,
So my son is on dad's phone plan. He has been eligible for a new phone for over a year and right now his very simple phone is very broken. He cannot get phone calls at all, this is not a surprise since dad has been well informed the entire last year. My son has offered to pay for the phone even though he gets no allowance and random babysitting jobs. I have offered to my son to pay for the phone while dad pays for the plan but he is determined that this is dad's thing to take care of and wants to do this himself. The last week or 2 without being able to call T has been hard. He is an independant 16 yo and we have no home phone. Finally T asked if I would pay the extra $30 a month for the upgraded plan but I have health insurance for kids going up $70 a month and need to talk to their dad about that.
Now dad is saying he will get him a very simple phone again and when he proves he can get good grades he will get him upgraded and a nicer phone. Great, now I get called into it. Kid is just pissed and hurt. There is no consideration for the grades he has gotten the last year while his phone continues to break, although he has struggled with his grades and dad's standards are nothing below a B (dad spent 7 years in college, kicked out once, and graduated with a 2.2 all the while receiving financial support). T had extreme anxiety issues, I walked him through many days getting to school, he ended up taking finals at home.
If I had the money I would just switch him to my plan and take care of this, not because I think he needs an upgraded phone but because he has to wait months and months to get things responded to, fixed, upgraded, etc. I would have to ask his dad for a little more money but this has been just one more BS drawn out issue with him, and of course they have to deal with it tonight!
If your son wants a phone & can pay for it, he can go get a pre-pay one. He is an independent 16 year old, and thus I would say that you need to stay out of it, and let him negotiate it directly with his Dad. It's time for him to manage that relationship, unless of course there is explicit abuse. You only get called into it if you choose to answer that call.
Dad's plan sounds reasonable. If T doesn't want to agree to that, he can buy his own pay as you go phone.
Sorry you're going through this stress, ZoeG, but I tend to agree with the above. My own parents would've laughed me out of the house if I'd asked them to purchase a phone for me and pay for an ongoing plan; I needed to get some sort of job and keep it if I wanted to afford life's luxuries, and let's face it: An "upgraded plan" has little to do with keeping him safe, more to do with more texting and data. It is a luxury, not a necessity. From an outsider's perspective, it's not like your ex is refusing to get him a phone at all...just bribing him with something better. There's nothing wrong with offering an incentive for getting better grades, imho.
Upgraded plan or upgraded phone? Not to complicate things unduly, but if Dad blows the upgrade on a simple phone, will he really have money later for a nicer phone? Most mobile phone companies do not offer subsidies anymore. Maybe he's planning on giving DS a hand-me-down phone. I don't want to get bogged down in the logistics; just given the difficulties you've had in collecting child support, I'm wondering if Dad really can pull off the upgrade.
But I agree with the rest of the posters: let your son get a prepaid phone (it can be a $20 wonder for now) and then he can get calls while working on Dad to pay for whatever Dad will. There's no reason for you to get in the middle of that, though you do have an interest in making sure DS has a phone.
try2bfrugal
7-15-13, 7:06pm
On the Mr. Money Mustache forum they post about $10 a month prepaid phone plans. If his Dad doesn't come through at all your son could pay for one of those with his babysitting money. Otherwise I think what his Dad offered is reasonable.
Okay, it is on the surface sounding reasonable, what is not reasonable is that T has been trying for months to get his dad to respond to the phone being broken and there are times safety is at issue. I don't know any neighbors, I do know some of his friends but not their families or addresses, if he went missing for any length of time I wouldn't have any way to reach him or send someone to find him. In they city when he takes the bus and gets himself around this is essential. And that has been happening with the phone breaking over at least 6 months. Honestly if he got a simple phone for him when his upgrade was eligible a year ago or even when his phone started breaking 6 months ago I would not have any problem.
The other thing that is simply hard is that dad easily makes 6 figures. The kids know this, they see what he buys for himself, they see the 2 i-phones that were in the $500 range, they see the special breed imported dogs, they see the 4 bedroom house with no spare bedroom for them to stay over. They know I do my best and don't upgrade everything for myself without including their needs. His issue with child support is simply he doesn't pay it on time. There is no demonstrated hardship,
So if I talk to dad I think I will keep the message clear and short, my concern is that this phone issue has not been handled in a reasonable amount of time, I have serious concerns about him keeping his word about upgrading, and if T gets a job (he is looking, hard to find at 16 sometimes) then we can get him his own plan with the phone he wants and not worry about dad's fees. It doesn't seem to be my issue except that if anything happens to the kids I am the only one responding (yeah the 1 year anniversary of the shooting at the theatre is this week, we are all having a hard time, my daughter is taking the anniversary day off, and no, dad never answered his phone when that happened. He turns it off, okay that was off topic but I realize part of my reactionary mood)
try2bfrugal
7-15-13, 7:36pm
Zoe Girl, you've got to let go and move on. The ex is a loser. He isn't being fair with his money. He isn't going to change.
Get the $10 phone plan for safety for your son and just accept the things you can't change. Also, you can look into lifeline cell and landline phone services for low income households and see if you qualify.
If you can't afford the $10 or get a lifeline phone, your son can earn $10 a month for a prepaid plan on online micro-job sites like mturk or fiverr, doing surveys, swagbucks, etc.
Sorry what you are going through about the shooting 1 year mark.
rodeosweetheart
7-15-13, 7:42pm
I see this from a different angle than the others. I see this situation as you describe it as a basic safety/parenting issue, and sinc eyou have physical custody of your son and you guys don't have a landline, he needs a working phone. So I would bite bullet and get son a phone on a plan with me, something real basic but working, and if he wants an upgraded phone that does more, he could help pay for it? Or split it as Christmas present or something?
I would disengage about comparisons to what Dad has and does--I know how hard it is, believe me, but I think it just confuses the issue. You guys need to figure out phone for safety reasons, and Dad has shown himself to be unreliable, undependable, and slow pay. So you and your son figure out a phone,a nd if Dad wants to do something better in future, he can do so.
Or get a prepaid with reasonable amount of minutes. If he wants more minutes, more pizzaz, he can use his baby sitting money.
You need to be able to reach him, and he needs to be able to reach you, his sibs, and his dad. If dad is not going to step up to the plate, I'd do it. He is your responsibility for two more years, and you are quite right that you need to be able to find him and vice versa.
I am really sorry you are going through the anniversary week of that trauma. I cannot imagine how difficult that must be.
Months without a phone? Has no one thought about getting a ten-dollar pay as you go flip phone at Radio Shack? At least for the time being. And get the information for his friends' parents all squared away.
Yes the phone has not been 100% broken during this time, I can send a text and he can kinda read it. Mostly he keeps saying dad is taking care of it, dad is going to call him back, he wants very much to work this out with dad, etc. I guess I feel mixed messages (within me, not necessarily from you guys). On one hand I need to back off and let dad handle it, on the other hand it is necessary that it be taken care of so I may need to step in. It is certainly not the first time, I took over all the dental care and spent thousands last year due to dad not taking care of it for 2 years. I recall the kids telling me they didn't have appointments but then assuring me that dad said he was going to call, then it would go into the category of things that concern me but the best advice is to leave it up to dad and not take over. Then finally daughter had a growing hole in her tooth and I just got everyone appointments and took care of it all. Same with getting driver's licenses. So it is very difficult to find that line of when to decide that it is not going to be taken care of, he does take care of some things like helping daughter buy a used car after all.
Doh, I feel like an idiot. I have a really old verizon phone that is prepay in a drawer. I am going to charge that up and put $20 on it, it barely texts but it can call and receive calls. I feel stupid, my only excuse is that I keep hearing it is being taken care of and then another week goes by ya know. (PS I have been offering the Christmas present thing and son wants dad to buy it, sigh)
ZG, is it time to ask your son what kind of support he would prefer you give him regarding negotiating these kinds of things with his Dad? Support for your son, I mean, not you taking over communications with his father. Speaking as a stepmom, there comes a time when our teens need to handle their relationship with each parent directly. Mid-teens is a good time to do this. And, not by complete abandonment, but with supportive coaching & empathy, but back off from problem-solving!Letting him try, fail, try, succeed, etc. is critical to his independence and his self-confidence.
And, obviously, dental care is one category. Getting a new phone, a driver's license, these are individuation milestones. Your son is capable, and needs to test his wings, IMO.
try2bfrugal
7-16-13, 12:27am
Doh, I feel like an idiot. I have a really old verizon phone that is prepay in a drawer. I am going to charge that up and put $20 on it, it barely texts but it can call and receive calls. I feel stupid, my only excuse is that I keep hearing it is being taken care of and then another week goes by ya know. (PS I have been offering the Christmas present thing and son wants dad to buy it, sigh)
ZG, don't feel like an idiot. You took the time to post, ask here for advice and thoughtfully consider all the responses. You sound like a concerned mom.
Just take care of the basics for safety and DS can earn his own money or negotiate with his dad for a cooler phone and better plan. If he can't find a job, maybe he could do the microjob sites online or put up flyers for babysitting, pet sitting, errands, yard work or dog walking. I found one of my babysitters through a flyer like that.
He'd only have to make an average of $1 a day for a $30 a month phone plan.
ToomuchStuff
7-16-13, 12:28am
Okay, it is on the surface sounding reasonable, what is not reasonable is that T has been trying for months to get his dad to respond to the phone being broken and there are times safety is at issue. I don't know any neighbors, I do know some of his friends but not their families or addresses, if he went missing for any length of time I wouldn't have any way to reach him or send someone to find him. WHOSE FAULT IS THAT? Go introduce yourself and ask him where they live! This coming from someone who was abducted as a kid, pre Amber alert days.
In they city when he takes the bus and gets himself around this is essential. And that has been happening with the phone breaking over at least 6 months. Honestly if he got a simple phone for him when his upgrade was eligible a year ago or even when his phone started breaking 6 months ago I would not have any problem.
I have a prepaid T moble phone as my only phone. The first year was $100, for 1000 minutes, I just refilled it (lasts one year) and $54 brought me back up to that range, which lasts me the year. I don't text, small keyboard and screen and it costs too much per text but seems some sell prepaid unlimited text phones, due to kids. Go to your computer (access) and check coverage maps for your area (or ask around who uses what, locally)
The other thing that is simply hard is that dad easily makes 6 figures. The kids know this, they see what he buys for himself, they see the 2 i-phones that were in the $500 range, they see the special breed imported dogs, they see the 4 bedroom house with no spare bedroom for them to stay over. They know I do my best and don't upgrade everything for myself without including their needs. His issue with child support is simply he doesn't pay it on time. There is no demonstrated hardship,
What he makes is irrelevant. It isn't your kids money, or yours. What is yours is the child support, and he shows he isn't timely, responsible, organized or trustworthy. Tell the kid to get stuff in writing, get it actionable.
So if I talk to dad I think I will keep the message clear and short, my concern is that this phone issue has not been handled in a reasonable amount of time, I have serious concerns about him keeping his word about upgrading, and if T gets a job (he is looking, hard to find at 16 sometimes) then we can get him his own plan with the phone he wants and not worry about dad's fees. It doesn't seem to be my issue except that if anything happens to the kids I am the only one responding (yeah the 1 year anniversary of the shooting at the theatre is this week, we are all having a hard time, my daughter is taking the anniversary day off, and no, dad never answered his phone when that happened. He turns it off, okay that was off topic but I realize part of my reactionary mood)
You should not be talking to your ex about this. It should be included from the attorney and too his attorney. I would even casually ask his attorney if his bills are paid ON TIME?
T has really been independent with talking to his dad and I am proud of him for that. I think where this gets mushed together is that there are a lot of feelings mixed in, feeling that I am angry I can't count on him to really be available, feeling that if he is going to be less than a weekend dad he can at least spoil the kid sometimes (sorry that is just a feeling and he is perfectly justified in not doing that), just crappy feelings when I see my kids hurt by watching how much dad has and how little he is willing to share. If he was even a person they could live with part time then they would get some of that standard of living but he really is not capable. Just really crappy feelings, and each solution suggested here has merit, and takes a lot of work, and no matter what I kinda just still feel like crap. When my ex lost his job and went to contract I just took over the health insurance (now it is $475 a month), I didn't go to my lawyer or otherwise push hard. I feel used that he just accepted that from me without a thought and without any offer to help with the cost while I thought he would take care of things like the phone, I think this likely makes no sense at this point.
On a note, the legal system is pretty much a mess. It cost $5K to handle the last thing I called the attorney about, and my ex and lawyer gave non-answers and run around for 11 months. I was totally in the right and eventually got it handled and paid, but I would rather not pay thousands if I am simply going to run in circles for as long as they want to play it out. So either my son gets a situation negotiated or I become part of it,
rodeosweetheart
7-16-13, 6:24am
I have a really old verizon phone that is prepay in a drawer. I am going to charge that up and put $20 on it, it barely texts but it can call and receive calls.
This sounds like a great idea--should do perfect for now, and maybe dad will work out something fancier later.
My sis spent years being angry & resentful at her ex over how much he had & how little he shared. Years of bitterness, misery, and blame. All it got her was more miserable.
I get that you wish he would pay for more. The truth of the situation is what it is... I am still periodically making myself miserable over my resentments of my stepkids mom. Pretty silly of me! All that makes me unhappy is fighting the truth of the situation.
What if your battle here isn't the phone, rather, it's about accepting the reality of the matter? What would happen if you simply dropped all expectations of anything being different?
ZG, your ex is who he is. I'm sure that behavior is at least one reason he's your ex. Short of some kind of Pauline conversion, he probably is never going to change. You know it (or should); hoping he'll change is just a waste of your energy.
Your kids may know it, too, but I think they hang on to the hope that their Dad will be in their lives what you are in their lives. DW's daughter went through much the same thing. DW's ex is all hat, no cattle, as they say in Texas. But DSD remained Daddy's Little Girl for years. Slowly, during her teenage years, when ex failed to be involved in some life milestones, it dawned on her that Daddy could not be counted upon. A kid can always hope, but reality clarified the picture. Now DSD maintains a healthy, pragmatic relationship with her father and what she saw as her mother's negative attitude has been borne out. And Daddy lost his Little Girl to what he did (or didn't).
The prepaid phone in the drawer is a great idea. It responds to your and your son's need to contact people when necessary. Son can continue to go after Dad for what he said he would do. But -- though you may hate to see it happen to your kids -- stuff like this will show to your kids who your ex is. And they need that accurate picture. Learning to listen to what people do rather than what they say is a critical life lesson. Shame they have to learn it from their father this way.
I will not spend wasted years in resentment, I promise that. We get these things happening on a regular basis and the kids have really learned that when dad is good to just enjoy it but they can't help but expect sometimes that means he is going to be better more often, then one of these things happens. So I have blown off more than a few and I will get over this, and eventually my son will, and then we will move on. But the attitude ex has that he is doing a great job by being tough on the kids is just costing them all the relationship. Tough has to have some heart with it or it is just mean.
PS LOVE the 'all hat, no cattle!!!' ex gets an additional income from a trust that has farm property so it really does fit.
My two oldest are technically step-kids. Their father took every opportunity to not spend money on them and to use it in a perverse power trip when he did. He actually tracked every single cent he ever spent on them right down to gas in the car for visits and ice cream on birthdays. He paid child support of $283/month for both kids and in his own mind we pocketed $200 of that for our greedy selves. He actually put a scan of his last support payment, from the month DD1 turned 18, along with the word "freedom" up as the screen saver on his home computer. It was a pretty emotional day when DS, then 21, called me to talk about that one. Anyway, the point is your ex isn't going to change. Cut the cord. If you depend on him for anything the odds are you will be disappointed. Forget about money, its irrelevant because you are the only real parent your son has ZoeG. It sucks, but it is what it is. Help your son explore options. Encourage him and support his decisions. Support him financially as you see appropriate keeping in mind he is only 16. Trust your gut. He WILL remember who was there for him.
Re: phone plan. We're on Ting which uses the Sprint network. $6/month to have a phone on the network and then you pay for actual use of voice, text and data. Our family bills went from $280/month to just under $100 in an average month with no discernible change in service. Might be another option worth looking at.
rodeosweetheart
7-16-13, 11:54am
Their father took every opportunity to not spend money on them and to use it in a perverse power trip when he did. ... Anyway, the point is your ex isn't going to change. Cut the cord. If you depend on him for anything the odds are you will be disappointed. Forget about money, its irrelevant because you are the only real parent your son has ZoeG. It sucks, but it is what it is.
Very well stated--this was my experience with my ex, and what we had to do. WE left the state as soon as we legally could, when the kids turned 18, and one elected to live with him, which lasted exactly 8 days. He ended up living in his car and dropping out of high school, and we got him back with us, got him a GED, got him a scholarship to college, SO happy he let us help him, but it was veyr hard for him to give up on his dad, since his dad had given up on him. He is still traumatized by his relationship with his father. All the kids are--their dad is an active alcoholic, sick adn crazy at this point. But he was incredibly mean, and alienated all 5 of his kids. He is bitter, paranoid,and I gave up expecting anything from him save misery, on behalf of the kid.
But he is sick, substance abuse, untreated, makes you crazy. One of the boys told me he was talking to his half brother about it (different moms) and they both said they had bee having dreams about their dad, that he was like he was years and years ago, and he came to apologize to them. Maybe his soul is wandering around at night, trying to make amends. Who knows? IT is very sad.
Zoe, the less you can depend on him, the less you depend on him for the kids, the better. Just make yor way with what you have, the child support, etc. and life at the lower level on the economic scale--we did this, while he continued to spend money on himself. But here, years later, all my kids are responsible with money, they are all incredibly hard workers, and they are very close from what they have been through.
Sorry, I know you weren't asking for advice, but I couldn't help but share my own experience, since your story reminds me of my own.
And Gregg, can I just say, you are a wonderful father.
Simplemind
7-16-13, 12:10pm
I love all the answers here and I would have to agree, it really isn't about the phone. Solving the phone problem is easy. Solving the feelings about the ex and fairness isn't even on the horizon. Mine paid no support for years and then just a token which has never increased although the toys in his driveway have. No matter, it is what it is.
Cellphones are not a necessity. Remember when we lived without them (safely) not that long ago? My son is also on his dad's plan with a crappy plan but it is good enough to get a call. He worked to pay for an I-touch which he uses for texts and doesn't come with any demands from dad or plan overages.
Hard as it sounds this really is more about issues with the ex than your son and his phone. Doesn't sound like your son has nearly the issue with it that you do. When my son went through a phoneless period I reminded him that almost anybody on his left or right would have a phone and he could always ask to borrow. I know I am a throw back but it is really weird to me that so many people feel they need to be connected by a device or it is unsafe. We didn't feel unsafe without them before.
Zoe,
I am going to reiterate what everybody has said before me. I think your son wants you to help him "fix" his dad. Do not get involved in this fight. You know he is unreliable, there is no fixing that. All prepaid cell phones come with unlimited text & voice nowadays. As somebody mentioned before, Republic Wireless (as mentioned on Mr. Money Mustache) has unlimited 9.99 or 19.99 per month plans and a smart phone. They have Sprint coverage. Just let the whole "dad should have/could have replaced the phone" issue drop. Your son is 16 and growing up. Part of growing up is becoming responsible for yourself and not depending on the goodwill of others (dad in this case). Selecting his own pre-paid plan (with your help) is just part of growing up.
Thanks all, I guess what I really needed was someone to sit with a hot cup and tea and spend 20 minutes saying 'yeah he is a a-hole'. The things the help the most are the stories actually of how this hurts the kids and it does not go away overnight. There is a special kind of pain that goes along with a parent who acts like this towards child support and basically caring for the kids (most of the time because the money is being passed through the hands of the caregiving parent and step-parent). I have taken over many things that were not being handled, went through the process of evaluating if it was really time to take over or not, then felt horrible guilt because I didn't do it sooner (dental) plus kept on adjusting my budget knowing that asking for adjustment in child support would be a part time job. I handle a lot of this, but I get tired and really pissed off too.
I need to talk to dad about something today (the large health insurance bill) but beforehand I am going to have T research these other phone plans. My upgrade/cancel date is not for 1 1/2 years so I am not sure I would transfer over myself but we could find something for him.
The difference between then and now vis-a-vis cell phones is that there used to be a pay phone on every corner. Not so much anymore. I think a basic cell is almost a necessity now, and really--they're getting cheaper all the time.
I won't really sidetrack on whether a cell phone is essential or not to others, It is to me. There are many reasons including the shooting and some of the mental challenges my middle one puts us through, and many people without those reasons find them essential. Yes we lived without them but it was really different then. When was the last time you pulled over for a stalled car? I assume they have a phone and do not check when 20 years ago in a small town in the mountains we knew everyone and you pulled over and helped everyone. Now I am wandering off when I just said I wouldn't, LOL
Simplemind
7-16-13, 3:57pm
What works for one does not necessarily work for another. I have a cellphone in my car for emergencies and wouldn't be without it. I don't carry it and use it otherwise. I honestly don't think the world is a different place but I do believe the media can make you feel that way. Bad things have always happened and always will. Good people far outnumber the bad and will lend you a hand (or a phone) and yes.... I do stop for stalled cars. Yes, I do something when I see something that is wrong.
Hoping you get your phone problems fixed soon :0)
So I feel half stupid, ex came over tonight and we talked. I told him my point of view which was the phone has been broken or partially broken for a long time. This is an issue that is legitimately my issue. So I did not argue the plan dad has but I did say that I have serious concerns about if he was going to follow through on his agreement in a timely manner. Also he wanted to have him order online when there is a verizon store down the street open until late. I pushed a little on that one, but also my son is switching back and forth on contacting dad as well.
Sorry to drag this all out,
This is kind of a side note, but I think its worth considering. Please don't downplay the importance of a smart, not cell, phone to the next generation. My gen went from saying a computer is nice, but not a necessity. Look at us now. The guys at Popular Mechanics named the smart phone #1 on their list of Gadgets That Changed the World (http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/reviews/101-gadgets-that-changed-the-world#slide-1). It has nothing to do with calling Mom or Angry Birds. Smart phones really are changing the world. The upcoming generation is going to do things with those devices that most of us over 40 can't even imagine. Not to be melodramatic, but if your son doesn't have access to that tool he will be behind the curve. After a few epiphanies I finally started looking at them for what they are, part of the kids education and a necessary tool to help them integrate into (their) society. You don't need to provide unlimited everything to facilitate that, but he deserves better than stone knives and bear skins.
rodeosweetheart
7-17-13, 9:53am
Good point, Gregg.
IT is a great point, Gregg. It is why I finally broke down and got rid of my beloved Jitterbug and got an iphone from Radioshack las month. At work, we are going to a delivery system that is mobile platform based, and I was being asked to design courses that were mobile platform based, and I had nothing to see them with, nothing to see where this was all going. Gregg is right, it is a huge, huge change, and it is affecting things--kind of like when my oldest went to college in 2000, every kid had to have a computer to really stay up to date, although I could not afford one for him and he did not get one until he financed one senior year. So yeah, I see where you are going with this, Gregg.
Zoe, we got a deal on the iphone--they were 199 for the 4 (old model) at Radioshack and then it is 30dollars a month, unlimited data and text and very limited calling--300 minutes--it is a prepaid with Virgin Mobile, no contract, which was important to us since we did not know if we would like them. We figured if we didn't like them, we would give them to one of the kids, but I really, really like mine and I am pretty low tech. Best of all, my dil can send me photos, and I can forward them to my parents.
I had zero dad in my life. ZERO. On *any* level. I had a job in highschool. And no cell phone. I turned out fine.
Thank you Gregg, that is really part of what I am seeing and I work with kids. Let me tell you introducing the point that it is my CAREER to work with kids actually backfires in most situations including counselors I have taken my kids to but also with their dad. OMG, I would respect his field of knowledge but when I tell him what is happening in the world of teens he gets angry, so i don't anymore. But I work in a 50%+ high poverty school and these kids have phones and they are important. Sometimes it is because there is no computer or internet at home, sometimes that phone is everything including music, connection to friends, information, calculator even. Remember how important our music was as teens? That is part of the phone. So after raising my kids my odd way and thinking they didn't need what the neighbors had because we were such a great family I realize that I am not their world at this age, and within reason they can fit in and have what others have. T's friend actually brings over his video game system and they play a lot, I am considering an old system. I buy soda and snack food more. I even respect they don't want organic vegetarian food so there is a lot more meat for growing kiddo.
I feel much better from what you said Gregg. I also realize that this was the utter feeling of doom (say doom in that echoey way, doom oom oom) of facing the nature of dad's passive aggressive crap. He can bring life to a totally halt if you depend on him. The girls know this and are able to manage their own lives, T is 16 and reasonably needs dad. So I feel great about how I handled it, dad stopped by (unannounced of course) but gave me child support and (gasp) apologized for it being late. I was on vacation out of state so I was okay with that. And then he listened to my concern that this phone issue has drug on for months, has not been handled well, and has created a safety issue where I considered just taking over and charging him for it. He was working with T that night to handle it. I think maybe the new wife is pushing him on the passive aggressive and CONSTANT lateness in life. Hmm.
Aqua Blue
7-17-13, 12:20pm
That was pretty much my experience too, although my Dad was present in the household but, he would not pay for anything other than food and a roof over our heads and he complained bitterly about that. By 16 I either worked and got something I wanted , or did without. I realize it is a different world out there now, but I don't see where it hurt me to start managing my own affairs early.
I had zero dad in my life. ZERO. On *any* level. I had a job in highschool. And no cell phone. I turned out fine.
Glad to hear (see) you more upbeat Zoe Girl. You obviously already know that doing what's best for the kids and sorting it out with X later, when even possible, is usually the best plan. There's a learning curve for all of us in similar situations, but there's no doubt you're on top of it. My kids are quite a bit older than yours so I get the benefit of seeing a bigger picture. Their memories of what a jerk their father was have faded...at least more than mine, lol. Overall that's a good thing. The interesting part is that whenever they need help or support or just need to talk something through they call DW and/or me, not X. Whether its even conscious or not I have no idea, but at some level they know who was there for them before and who always will be. My congratulations to you because I suspect your kids will be exactly the same way.
Gardenarian
7-17-13, 12:37pm
Thanks all, I guess what I really needed was someone to sit with a hot cup and tea and spend 20 minutes saying 'yeah he is a a-hole'.
Yep, sometimes it is as simple as that. He's an a-hole allright. Pass the sugar!
But I work in a 50%+ high poverty school and these kids have phones and they are important. Sometimes it is because there is no computer or internet at home, sometimes that phone is everything including music, connection to friends, information, calculator even. Remember how important our music was as teens? That is part of the phone.
ZG, you raise an important point here: there have been studies of the "Digital Divide" that confirm that smartphones are increasingly taking the role of computers for younger people (beyond teenagers to about 30-35). They do have some deficiencies (screen real estate, ultimate processing power, keyboards) but, then, I can't stuff my MacBook in my pocket and nobody let me buy the Apple for $49 and then with installment payments after that. Especially in an age in which, increasingly, kids do not show off their cars (if they even have them) and clothing has standardized greatly, one's electronic devices are a way to both stand out and fit in. And, as we discovered as kids, not always stand out and fit in the "right" way.
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