View Full Version : Kleptomaniac Son
We're planning to get him to a therapist, so maybe posting here is just venting. Many of you might remember that when our son was very young, he used to steal from me. He would go out of his way to steal my most precious possessions, accomplishing acrobatic feats I would think impossible for one so small. My brother passed away from ALS in 2004 and left my daughter his wedding band. My son promptly stole it from my dresser drawer, and I found it in his room. I put it in the back of the top shelf of my closet. He somehow managed to find it there and give it to a girl in the neighborhood. That was when he was five or six years old. He also cut many of the quarters out of the mint sets my father had collected for me from my birth. That was one of the few things my father left me after his death. That now seems a long time ago, but I was furious for a long time that I had to keep everything that was important to me locked up in a trunk.
Jump forward about six years. My son has been taking the bus downtown for the better part of the year. I thought it would be good for his independence. Recently, he claimed he had found his "Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty." My wife said that he couldn't have found it because she had found it under his bed when she was cleaning his room and threw it out. I asked him where he got it, and he admitted that he shoplifted it. He said that he knew it was wrong but he took it because he didn't have any. He also admitted to taking five cans of it this summer. (I didn't say it, because it is wrong, but he is stealing it from a small local store that befriended him on his wanderings this summer). I marched him down there and made him pay for it out of his allowance.
He claims that he did not steal anything else, but there are many, many suspicious things that he has always explained away. Our elderly neighbor who loves him like a grandson thinks he stole an opal necklace and two rings from her. (What would an eleven year old do with that?) My wife thinks he has stolen a necklace from her that I bought her for $75 for Mother's Day. (Which is a lot for me). He showed up with a lot of expensive Dr. Who stuff this summer that he claimed was on clearance. (He gets $40 a month allowance, but he had about seven figurines that cost about $15 each).
I usually give him the benefit of the doubt. He's sweet, intelligent, and kind.
I thought marching him down to the store to pay for the items he shoplifted would have been enough.
However, today I got a call from his teacher that she found the teacher's math book with all the answer keys in it in his backpack. So I have to go meet with her on Wednesday.
Admittedly, I feel like s**t. I took twelve years off from my life to be an at-home-dad. What did I accomplish? I raised a super-smart boy that steals things and cheats. How did that happen? I thought being there for my kids would do the trick. Now I'm working part time, and I'm always home when my son gets home to help him with his homework, etc.
My mother faced the same kind of behavior with my brother. He was frequenting bars when he was 13. Whenever my mother found out, she would call the police and have him arrested. I told him today that the next time I found that he had stolen something, I would call the police myself. There is a dark part of me that really does not even want him around if he is going to behave that way at eleven years old.
I myself was terrified of stealing things. Once, when I was a boy, I absent-mindedly walked out of a convenience store with a handful of candy. I tremblingly walked back to the store to pay for it, convinced that the police were going to be all over me at any minute.
I don't know why he stole so much from me when he was little, and I don't know why he is shoplifting, stealing from his teacher, and cheating on his homework now. I'm so angry I could just walk out into the desert and sit for a week.
I guess putting time into our children doesn't really make them turn out the way we want them to.
My dear, this is probably an anxiety disorder, I would suspect an organic brain thing, NOT a moral issue! Get both of you to a psychologist ASAP. You both deserve support & help. He is still your darling son.
My dear, this is probably an anxiety disorder, I would suspect an organic brain thing, NOT a moral issue! Get both of you to a psychologist ASAP. You both deserve support & help. He is still your darling son.
+1
Absolutely get outside help. Compulsive stealing and most likely lying have pretty deep roots. I know one child who does this that has been diagnosed with OCD among other things. It's a compulsion in him....not you. Its NOT anything you did in the way you parented or raised him so please don't waste time feeling guilty but instead see it for what it is and find help.
iris lilies
10-7-13, 10:13pm
I wish you well with this, I know that you've been an attentive father and provide great growing experiences for your kids. I hope the therapist can put a finger on this problem.
try2bfrugal
10-7-13, 10:25pm
I don't have any words of wisdom on the stealing front except that it is tough being a parent, and I wish you luck in getting your son the help he needs. It sounds like your son has many great qualities, so be proud of yourself on that front. Being a good parent doesn't mean having kids that never have any issues or shortcomings, it just means being there to help pick them up when they fall.
One area that often gets overlooked at in any kind of mental health issue is diet. It is often tough to get kids that age to eat healthy and nutritional needs can skyrocket before and during puberty. This is a good link on the subject -
http://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/help-information/mental-health-a-z/D/diet/
I agree with everyone above, Paul -- this isn't your fault and your son probably has some psychological/neurological issues that hopefully therapy and other approaches can help with.
I also second try2bfrugal's suggestion to look closely at how diet affects his behavior. Looking back on my childhood and adolescence I often wonder if some of my worst phases could have been radically altered by different diet/exercise/sleep patterns. Take someone with low blood sugar/pressure and seratonin issues and have them consuming peanut M&Ms and a coke for lunch every day (my preferred lunch in high school when I was in a depressive episode) and you are going to end up with pretty predictable roller coaster emotions. Add to that no exercise (no energy) and horrible sleep habits and I was pretty much a walking disaster.
I don't have anything to add, since everyone has given good advice. I just want to give you a big hug. Its very sad, when you've tried to be a good father, to find out your son has these problems. But keep giving him love, and definitely get some help for him.
I agree with all the above and add my hug, as well. I've often said it's too bad they don't come with a manual; we learn as we go. You're doing the right thing getting some therapy; I hope it brings results soon for your family. Take care.
I agree with what the others have said but will add a few things as well....don't let your son take the bus to the downtown area by himself. That is a recipe for disaster if your son steals. I also wouldn't let him go into the neighbors homes either until all of this can be worked through. He has to earn the right to do those things. If he gets caught he will have a record and may have to spend time in juvenile hall which could go very badly.
try2bfrugal
10-9-13, 2:45am
I agree with what the others have said but will add a few things as well....don't let your son take the bus to the downtown area by himself. That is a recipe for disaster if your son steals. I also wouldn't let him go into the neighbors homes either until all of this can be worked through. He has to earn the right to do those things. If he gets caught he will have a record and may have to spend time in juvenile hall which could go very badly.
This is all good advice, plus I would put him on notice that until he has re-earned your trust his room is going to be searched without warning. Written contracts are always good, too, with rewards for no stealing after a certain period of time and some type of logical consequences if he does steal again.
When does it become a power struggle with efforts to circumvent the restrictions though? It is a tough situation but you will get through it.
I believe what your son's doing is an addiction, as hard as any other to break. If you try therapy, try to find one who deals with addictions. Good luck.
Boy, I don't have time to get on the computer often. Thanks for all your advice. We met with his teacher today, and we are going to look for a therapist through the solutions group at work - though that's a short-term thing. We'll have to see if he needs something longer term.
Diet has always been a struggle. I'm a typical whole-foods parent. I'm one of those people who makes his own tempeh. We have always had some bits of chocolate here and there, but we're not the type of parents who grab candy bars at the cash register.
Zeb somehow finds and eats loads of candy. He used to get candy from a neighbor when he was small, and we would find mounds of candy wrappers behind his bed. He seems to be buying candy when he goes to do stuff. He bicycled to Hobby Lobby the other day to buy something for school, and I found an empty milk duds box from there stuffed full of lollipop sticks. He must have eaten ten lollipops. He's maintained since he was little that he's a kid and kids eat candy and we're weird for eating tempeh.
Hi again,
Just be sure he's getting enough of the vitamins and minerals in the food you give to him. Are you vegetarian? Vegan? You can get really low in some things with both those diets. But I have the feeling you've always been on top of that.......but just thought I'd mention it.
I used to see a psychopharmacologist who would decide what meds I needed (I have ADD). He said that its really common for people to be street pharmacists.........meaning that they gravitate towards the things they need to balance their brains. Maybe that's going on with your son? I'm not saying he needs candy........but maybe there is another deficiency he has, that somehow pushes him to eat so much sugar.
Has he had a good blood work-up recently?
May I ask how old your son is?
You did not cause this, you can not control this and you can not change it. The three Cs.
Professional help for him and you. He is your wonderful son.
Ps I have lived through my son's issues, lowest darkest place imaginable, came out the other side, the sun was still shining :cool: For my son too .
This is all good advice, plus I would put him on notice that until he has re-earned your trust his room is going to be searched without warning. Written contracts are always good, too, with rewards for no stealing after a certain period of time and some type of logical consequences if he does steal again.
Given his age and the strong likelihood that this is a mental health concern, I would frame boundaries as a safety issue, not a trust issue. He needs to be able to come to you to talk about what's happening for him, and that is based on trust. If he was behaving inappropriately due to a fever, you would not bring trust into it, you'd set up safety guidelines & boundaries to keep him safe while his medical issue is addressed. I hope you can get a referral to a specialist, SS you & he both deserve competent, professionally support.
flowerseverywhere
10-9-13, 9:40pm
You did not cause this, you can not control this and you can not change it. The three Cs.
Professional help for him and you. He is your wonderful son.
.
I agree with you, but with a young son you can set limits, like not going to stores alone, and consequences. But the time to do it is when everyone is calm, not when you are so mad you feel like your eyeballs are going to pop out (ask me how I know that) Some kids are really tough no matter what a great parent you are and how consistent and caring you have tried to be. I hope you get a good counselor who can help identify some areas to work on that will help him move in the right direction.
try2bfrugal
10-9-13, 11:35pm
Given his age and the strong likelihood that this is a mental health concern, I would frame boundaries as a safety issue, not a trust issue. He needs to be able to come to you to talk about what's happening for him, and that is based on trust. If he was behaving inappropriately due to a fever, you would not bring trust into it, you'd set up safety guidelines & boundaries to keep him safe while his medical issue is addressed. I hope you can get a referral to a specialist, SS you & he both deserve competent, professionally support.
If he was just stealing random stuff I would agree with the fever analogy, but technically kleptomania is an addiction to stealing items that are not related to personal use or a monetary gain. The teacher's answer book, toys for personal use and gifts for girls aren't really random items.
If he was just stealing random stuff I would agree with the fever analogy, but technically kleptomania is an addiction to stealing items that are not related to personal use or a monetary gain. The teacher's answer book, toys for personal use and gifts for girls aren't really random items.
I was being a little imprecise with the kleptomania reference. I would say that on some level, it seems that he gets to the point where he REALLY wants something, and he can't control his impulse to take it. Because of my loss of trust at this point, I can't say how widespread the problem is, and that's another reason I think the counseling will help. When he was young, I think he stole things from me in retaliation for my not paying attention to him. It was very difficult being an extremely introverted parent being the at-home-caregiver for an extremely extroverted son. He thrives off contact. It's been like parenting an emotional black hole that drains me completely. I've been doing the Artist's Way exercises -- I know someone else started that thread -- and she talks about bewaring the crazy makers in your life. He's definitely been a crazy maker, but mainly because of our disparity in personalities. He seems to sense when someone is reading, or writing, or even just enjoying a moment, and he hones in. At my most angry, I've thought he was a budding little sociopath, but he really isn't. He's very warm and caring and bright. He's definitely capable of creating disillusions around the "it's not fair" scenario. I think that he reasons that it's not fair for him not to have something if he wants it. And he wants oh so many things. He gets $40 of allowance a month, which seems like an enormous amount to me for an eleven year old, (then I think, in this economy, $10 a week is not much). He rips through it quickly, on expensive things. To his credit, they are often things he uses. He has started a chess club at his elementary school, and he has joined the chess club at the charter school he will be attending next year, and he spent this month's allowance on chessboards. (I give myself a $50 a month allowance, and I'm often mad at how cavalierly he spends his and then expects more from me. I'm very careful with that money. $5 is still a lot of money in my eyes, but he gets tired of hearing it.) Being a frugally oriented person, and trying to pay the mortgage off, (it's down to $9,500), I torment myself for days over whether I want to go out and buy a cup of coffee. That type of thinking is completely foreign to his personality, though maybe it's because he's just a kid.
We're over our very, very, very, angry phase and looking into finding professional help.
I just want to give you a little hope. When our DS was young, he was impossible. No, he didn't steal, but he was out of control. We thought he probably had ADHD. Everything was ALWAYS everyone else's fault. He had no impulse control at all. (Yet, like your's, he is very warm and caring and bright). While he was growing up, it was like riding a bucking bronco. I just had to hold on as best I could........while constantly trying to direct him in better directions.........and letting him know that I loved him always.
And now......he's 24 and is incredible. He's calm for the most part, and I would even call him a genius. He is so talented.
I would NEVER have seen this coming. NEVER.
So continue to do the best you can......you just never know. There will (hopefully) be a day when you realize how very much worth it all your hard work was!
P.S..........hormones around ages 11-14 can wreak havoc on their brains too!
I think hormones has a lot to do with it. He can spend five hours at the table teaching himself to write the Gallifrean alphabet from Dr. Who, but then he trembles with frustration and bursts into tears as soon as he has to work on his statistics homework. Finding the median is just toooooo haaaaaard.
try2bfrugal
10-11-13, 12:08pm
I was being a little imprecise with the kleptomania reference.
I didn't mean to parse words on the kleptomania part, I was just responding to the fever analogy from an earlier post. Stealing for personal gain means seems to me that while there may be mental health issues involved like, poor impulse control or risk seeking behavior, it isn't the same as something like acting delirious from a fever, where the behavior isn't any kind of conscious choice at all. If he was stealing totally random things like cat food or make up remover, that might require a different action plan than stealing quiz answers and toys.
One book that really helped us, especially with a challenging extroverted child was, Setting Limits with Your Strong-Willed Child: Eliminating Conflict by Establishing Clear, Firm and Respectful Boundaries by Robert J. MacKenzie. It was written by a teacher who studied what the most successful teachers in terms of student behavior were doing right.
pcooley,
Man...........that sounds so much like my son when he was younger! Hang in there!
catherine
10-11-13, 2:04pm
I just want to give you a little hope. When our DS was young, he was impossible. No, he didn't steal, but he was out of control. We thought he probably had ADHD. Everything was ALWAYS everyone else's fault. He had no impulse control at all. (Yet, like your's, he is very warm and caring and bright). While he was growing up, it was like riding a bucking bronco. I just had to hold on as best I could........while constantly trying to direct him in better directions.........and letting him know that I loved him always.
And now......he's 24 and is incredible. He's calm for the most part, and I would even call him a genius. He is so talented.
I would NEVER have seen this coming. NEVER.
So continue to do the best you can......you just never know. There will (hopefully) be a day when you realize how very much worth it all your hard work was!
There's a lot I relate to here as well. I have documented here frequently about my son, who was a handful, a roller coaster ride, and a high school drop-out. I agree with Cathy.. I ADMIRE him SO MUCH. He is a very special person--always a big smile on his face, always ready with creative solutions for anyone's problems, smart, outgoing, etc. Waiting for his bar exam results.
He said that the "secret of his success" was the acceptance he received from his family. Now, I in NO WAY take credit for his success, but I can say that we had low patience for the pigeon-hole mentality that a lot of people had. We did not accept unacceptable behavior on his part, but we did try to appreciate his "idiosyncracies."
That's great to hear catherine!
I started realizing that really creative, intelligent kids can tend to act in "unacceptable ways" when they're young. I don't know what it is. Maybe they are just bored? Maybe they're minds are going 100 miles an hour, without the maturity to direct their energy? I just don't know.
So even if the things they want to obsess about aren't school-related......maybe encouraging those things would calm them? Its just really hard and painful to try to guess what is best at the time.
Whenever DH and I want to reminisce, we end up talking about the struggles with DS. They are funny now.........but they definitely weren't then. I just wish we could have had a small glimpse of the wonderful/brilliant/creative/funny/sensitive young man he eventually became. It would have definitely helped with our frustrations back then!
But now, pcooley.........you have 2 of us with examples of what your son might end up being like..........so don't despair! :)
BarbieGirl
10-19-13, 8:17pm
I can't stress enough the importance of getting appropriate help. You need to talk to your pediatrician and ask for referrals for a good child psychologist/psychiatrist.
Sometimes (dare I say most of the time) the professionals that are in HMOs aren't enough. You need specialized help.
With my sons I quickly realized the doctors I could use from my medical insurance were worse than useless. You will waste precious time and money.
I have decent healthcare insurance but my children's psychologist and psychiatrist don't accept insurance. But they have helped as none of the others EVER have. I have viewed this expense as critical as air and water to my boys.
Just another thing....I would certainly limit the amount of time your child has to go out and about without supervision to zero. I wouldn't allow him out of my sight until you have his behavior under control, for his own sake. He may resent it, but you need to monitor his behavior and keep him safe from himself.
I have been in your shoes and can tell you it CAN get better! Lots better! It has taken YEARS but we are finally seeing the fruits of our sacrifice. It is better than anything I could ever buy with money.
I just thought I would post an update. He's had five sessions with a therapist who specializes in children, (and she worked with prisoners and people with substance abuse issues in the past, so she's seen a wide range of behaviors). Today is the last session covered by the solutions group plan. Our insurance will cover an additional twenty sessions a year. We're all meeting with her today to discuss whether and how he needs to proceed with counseling. It's one of those things where I don't know how to judge whether he's being benefitted or not, so I'm looking forward to the meeting today. My wife believes that she has seen an improvement in his general behavior.
He also surprised us and surprised himself yesterday by getting an honor roll certificate from his school. He had been struggling with math and feeling angry about homework. He had brought the math grade up to a "C", so I still wasn't expecting him to be on honor or merit roll, but he had some high grades (a 113 average in reading), and that brought his overall GPA into honor roll territory. I was very proud of him.
Congratulations on the success of honor roll (to him and to you)! That is the kind of positive reinforcement that can go a long way. And all the best as you keep working so hard to do what's best for your son. Being a parent that went through some struggles with a son I can tell you that, beyond any doubt, its worth it.
mtnlaurel
11-15-13, 1:45pm
If I knew where to find an emoticon doing cartwheels I would insert it here.
What great news! Thank you for sharing it with us.
How fantastic that your insurance is covering some of that!
What a blessing that the counselor has been beneficial.
try2bfrugal
11-15-13, 2:24pm
Great news!
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