Conavirus......

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Originally Posted by JaneV2.0

The excuse doctors use for over-prescription seems to be "You may have a concomitant bacterial infection, too--so just to be sure..."
Australian researchers have managed to clone the virus, so a vaccine is likely in the works.
I wonder if existing anti-virals work on this strain.

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It may be an excuse, but many times people will come down with a bacterial infection on top of viral infection, so I'm not sure I would disagree with having antibiotics on hand, or if the doctor hit a questionable mystery illness with antibiotics after someone had been battling a virus less than successfully.

The bacterial is the secondary infection, obviously. My husband just had a viral bronchitis for 8 weeks and finally went to the doctor and he cleared his lungs with 5 days on an antibiotic. I don;t think he over-prescribed. But I'm not a doctor, and actually, try to stay away from doctors.

Am I wrong in thinking about this as about the same level of scariness as the flu? It kind of makes me feel better to think about it that way because, even though the flu is no joke, I don't spend all day worrying about it.

Below are some stats about the flu. I copied these from a site called sharecare.com which I hadn't heard of before, but the information matched with numerous other sites where I saw the same stats.


"The flu infects millions of us -- 5 to 20 percent of the U.S. population, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). In Canada, 10 to 25 percent of the population gets the flu each year, according to Health Canada. It can leave us achy, sniffling, sneezing, coughing and generally feeling miserable for a few days or weeks.


Most think of the flu as a mild annoyance that comes around each winter, but it can be a very dangerous disease. In the United States alone, the CDC estimates that more than 200,000 people are hospitalized each year with the flu or with flu-related complications. More than 36,000 people die.


The World Health Organization has determined that the flu kills between 250,000 to 500,000 people each year."

I have seen similar flu figures that are intended to make the coronavirus seem less like some sort of pandemic. From what I can tell, we probably don't know. The numbers out of China are probably understated or incorrect, but a mortality rate of about 2%. The flu virus numbers are large in part because it is relatively common. Comparing the two, if 5% of the US 300 million population gets the corona virus with a mortality rate of 2%, the death toll might be 300,000. Rather than comparing absolute numbers, it makes more sense to talk about in terms of communicability and mortality rate. I don't think we know enough about things, yet.

We are approaching it we would any other possible epidemic at the hospital where I work. I think of it as similar to influenza, SARS, MERS, etc. The difference is we know less detail about how this virus works.

The truth is that humans are always vulnerable to pandemics and sudden death. We just forget that most of the time as we go about our lives.

The number one hint for avoiding just about any air-borne communicable disease, beyond social isolation: don't touch your face with your hands. Unless someone actually coughs or sneezes in your immediate vicinity you're most likely to pick up germs by touching things that have microscopic-droplets of mucus or saliva on them and then touching your eyes, mouth or nose.

I was talking about this last night and realized that while some people may be over reacting, some are just either too young or ... bad at math. The whole "the flu kills 20-80K people a year so this is no big deal" contingent. The 1918 pandemic killed approximately 2.5% of the people on earth. Today's 2.5% is closing in on 200 million people. Not saying this is "the big one" but that number gives some idea of what disease can do.

They’ve just confirmed that the Chicago area woman who got it from travel to China has now passed it to her husband.

I’m waiting to see how it’s going to affect my work (int’l shipping). So far all my China offices and vendors are working from home. I have stuff scheduled to sail next week and we’re wondering if there will be workers to load the ships.

Vegas thinks they have a case but it will be 2 days before they know for sure.

Obviously not a fully valid comparison, but over a few generations something like 90 or 95 percent of the Native American populations died from diseases introduced by Europeans.

The WHO just officially declared it an international emergency.

Even here in my most progressive little corner of the world, I'm seeing this incident cause all sorts of ugly racism and stereotypes to pop up:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/30/opini...ang/index.html

People never fail to disappoint me.

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Originally Posted by bae

Even here in my most progressive little corner of the world, I'm seeing this incident cause all sorts of ugly racism and stereotypes to pop up:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/30/opini...ang/index.html

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Of the two linked articles about Chinese scientists, the first one is unavailable. I am interested in widespread “purging” of U.S. citizen-scientists from university teaching rosters. Too bad that article is absent. Chinese undergrads and grad students are a backbone of Agriculture programs all over the country, so I find it hard to believe place like ISU AG will give up that lucrative Yen fueled tuition.

The second article, a summary type piece, gives no information about what led to Xin Zhao’s investigation and charges. Entirely race based? That is preposterous.

The rest of this CNN article is a history lesson or anecdotes.

As for contemporary narrative, my sister in law called this morning. She is recently back from
China. She said they took her temperature and that of her husband before they could board the plane home to the U.S.

Our latest state-level guidance:

https://www.doh.wa.gov/Emergencies/C...irus/Resources

Of note for me is the new prehospital contact/transport guidance, which basically has us implement SARS/MERS protocols, which is not quite the full Ebola suit, thank goodness:

https://www.doh.wa.gov/Portals/1/Doc...S2019-nCoV.pdf

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Originally Posted by JaneV2.0

People never fail to disappoint me.

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Same here. Rob

Jane and Rob, your expectations are clearly too high. People often surprise me pleasantly.

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Originally Posted by bae

I'm on the regional infectious disease control team. ...

It is fascinating to watch the political posturing, media fluffery, anti-science mobs, and conspiracy nuts develop during the situation.

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Thank you for taking us behind the scenes. I tend to think hard about "media fluffery" before getting overly concerned.

But last night, I heard Anthony Fauci on PBS ("I think you have to be realistic and say, it is possible that it could turn into a global pandemic"). I've begun taking this more seriously.

Here is the transcript and video of the segment with Fauci:


https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/wh...-u-s-officials

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Originally Posted by Chicken lady

Jane and Rob, your expectations are clearly too high. People often surprise me pleasantly.

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I fully agree, CL!

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Originally Posted by bae

So, do you know what antibiotics do?

How well do they work on viruses?

Show your sources...

I might also recommend looking into the FEMA structure marking protocols, and make sure your neighbors understand them...

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The whole point of these herbs is to boost immunity in the first place, in an affordable way. And I'm already finding that oil of oregano gives me more energy. Rob

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Originally Posted by Tybee

It may be an excuse, but many times people will come down with a bacterial infection on top of viral infection, so I'm not sure I would disagree with having antibiotics on hand, or if the doctor hit a questionable mystery illness with antibiotics after someone had been battling a virus less than successfully.

The bacterial is the secondary infection, obviously. My husband just had a viral bronchitis for 8 weeks and finally went to the doctor and he cleared his lungs with 5 days on an antibiotic. I don;t think he over-prescribed. But I'm not a doctor, and actually, try to stay away from doctors.

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Not sure how or if this applies, but I am going BACK to the dr in 45 minutes. I first went exactly 1 month ago today with congestion, a "producing" cough that wouldn't quit,- but no chest pain like when I've had bronchitis - and low grade temp. That visit got me 10 days of Amoxicillan (told dr that doesn't work on me - but what do I know about my own body?!?!?!) In the following month, "producing" cough never completely went away, but started feeling better.

Woke up this morning with increased cough and now chest pain while coughing. NOT waiting for symptoms to get worse, but am wondering what the treatment will be this time.

If I end up on more/stronger antibiotics, I do/will consider it over-prescribing simply because they didn't prescribe correctly in the first place.

Sigh... a month is too long. I'm tired of feeling like crap. (Sorry for the whining.)

In my brief searches for updates, there is an incredible amount of misinformation and conspiracy theory floating around in social media. One of my concerns, which might border line some of these, is that we seem to live in an age of disinformation. Thinking of hurricane Dorian as an example, I have a low level of trust of our current administration to be forthcoming with accurate and honest information. He's pretty much of a science moron and may want to protect wall street. So that's my conspiracy theory.

Good luck, Happystuff.

Happy, I had a bad cold 2 months ago and a non productive cough that never went away. Now I have another cold, sore throat and cough. This is getting old.

Thanks, rosarugosa and TT.

Diagnosis is now, officially, bronchitis and meds are now 12 day course of prednisone and a pint bottle of Promethazine+ cough medicine. Have to laugh at the big bottle of cough medicine - it says don't drink alcohol while using, yet right on front says "Alcohol 7.0%". At least I may sleep a little better. ;)

TT - good luck shaking whatever you have. Don't wait too long to get to a dr, if you have to.

I bet you will sleep better:)).

The Washington Post had an article saying the Coronavirus is less of a threat than the flu...for now. Then today the Pentagon announced they were prepared to house 1,000 quarantined people in military bases. I've watched too many zombie films, but that is sounding familiar. I'm probably still in the not enough information place, but aside from the more important issues of life and health, it's not stacking up very well for the global economy.

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Originally Posted by happystuff

Thanks, rosarugosa and TT.

Diagnosis is now, officially, bronchitis and meds are now 12 day course of prednisone and a pint bottle of Promethazine+ cough medicine. Have to laugh at the big bottle of cough medicine - it says don't drink alcohol while using, yet right on front says "Alcohol 7.0%". At least I may sleep a little better. ;)

TT - good luck shaking whatever you have. Don't wait too long to get to a dr, if you have to.

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You know, I was going to suggest prednisone, but since I'm not a doctor, nor do I play one on the internet . . .

Prednisone has saved my life on more than one occasion.

I'm sure my eyes have suffered, and I know my weight has suffered, but I'm alive, so there is that.

My 91 year old dad is taking it now and has a new lease on life. His quality of life is infinitely better than it was a year ago.

Obviously, if you can get off it when you are done with the burst, that is better still!

Prednisone has been a multi-use drug for my dogs.

Prednisone is a wonder drug when used at the right time and in the right amounts. It has some really serious side effects but oh, the relief. At one time I would have seriously considered getting some from a vet when the doctor told me to just suffer.

I wonder about the draconian measures being taken to contain this virus. What do they know that they're not telling the world, exactly?

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Originally Posted by JaneV2.0

I wonder about the draconian measures being taken to contain this virus. What do they know that they're not telling the world, exactly?

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Agreed. I have a very hard time trusting any government - yes, this includes Austria, by the way (Holocaust involvement and inability to fess up to it's involvement therein until very recently with the Sebastian Kurz government). Because of this I of course try to keep up with what the media is saying.....taken with a huge boulder of salt and a dose of herbal over the counter immune boosters. I know of a gloom porn site (if you depress easily, don't check it out), The Economic Collapse Blog, that claims that the death count and infected counts are realistically much higher. There is also leaked video of the inside of the hospital in Wuhan with scores of sick folks clogging the aisles and supposedly three deceased patients and no one to deal with the bodies. Very very creepy.

My advice? Herbal immunity boosters.....I don't know what else one can do at this point but I'd also be avoiding travel right now, too - though I still would go to Mexico (at the moment) until such a date as the virus wreaks havoc there. Ay carumba.....those who don't like everything being made in China? Perhaps in the future not as much will indeed be made there? Maybe Central America could be the low wage manufacturing hub in the future? Such might keep migrants away from the border and would serve to give this area desperately needed jobs. Rob

It's never a bad idea to bolster your immunity with foods and supplements--and keep your microbiome--the foundation of immunity--happy with fermented foods and pre-and pro-biotics.

Rob,
I am disappointed if that doom and gloom website you mention doesn't implicate a deliberately engineered virus, developed from HIV, as the conovirus. Doomdayers are nothing without their conspiracy theories.

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Originally Posted by iris lilies

Rob,
I am disappointed if that doom and gloom website you mention doesn't implicate a deliberately engineered virus, developed from HIV, as the conovirus. Doomdayers are nothing without their conspiracy theories.

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Sorry to disappoint, IL. No such claims have been made by this site - to date, anyway. Rob

Made a doctor appointment for tomorrow. 2 months of coughing is getting old and I have had a bad headache all day that aspirin won’t fix and my BP is high.

Over 20,000 cases now despite the quarantine of millions, face masks, airport screenings, flight cancellations and so on.

I thought this was an excellent NPR article about why the coronavirus is different than the flu and why so many precautions are being taken. I thought it put some of the unknowns into a perspective that is neither panicky or passive.

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsan...-so-aggressive

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Originally Posted by Teacher Terry

Made a doctor appointment for tomorrow. 2 months of coughing is getting old and I have had a bad headache all day that aspirin won’t fix and my BP is high.

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Hope the dr visit did some good and you are on your way to feeling better.

According to Al-Jazeera, China is speed-building hospitals to treat the afflicted. First time I've heard of that happening.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/...033913557.html

Johns Hopkins posts current total number of case, number of deaths, and number recovered, and also breaks them down by country along with an interactive map. At least so far there doesn't appear to be any big escalations outside of mainland China. Unfortunately, the chart showing number of cases by day is not leveling off.

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/a...23467b48e9ecf6