Considering vast numbers of the protestors being mentioned, even though they are irrelevant to the subject, were white people (portland is pretty white you know). Uh ...
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Considering vast numbers of the protestors being mentioned, even though they are irrelevant to the subject, were white people (portland is pretty white you know). Uh ...
I don’t understand this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by ApatheticNoMore
The subject here is “Coup.” Other terms used are “rioting “” protesting. “
The world/US is more and bigger than St Louis, MO: just saying...Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies
Probably should delete this post but...
Do You believe that everything is not about race? If so, then...Quote:
Originally Posted by razz
Congratulations. So do I.
I think it's interesting to see so much talk of race in a discussion about something that has nothing to do with race. Yesterday we saw a perfect example of what happens when a mob coalesces around a narrative and today (on a much smaller level) we get to hear judgmental condemnation from others actively coalescing around another narrative.
It's easy to see how mobs form.
As discussions have a tendency to do, there is progression and often times side topics are developed and included. Unless I totally missed something (sorry if I have!), the topic of race was introduced to this discussion based on the police/security response to the "mob/group/protesters/whatever you want to call them" actions in yesterday's events versus the police/security responses to other "mob/group/protesters/whatever you want to call them" in the recent past.
Again, I stand by my previous post that I do believe race - at some point and to some degree - had *something* to do with yesterday's events as much as it had to do with previously mentioned events.
We are all acknowledging that a white protester was shot dead yesterday, right? Does that help to even out Racial injustice by police,?Quote:
Originally Posted by happystuff
But many of the BLM protesters WERE white. It may have more to do with police forces being infiltrated by far right groups. But also there actually is an argument for deescalation not escalation in such a situation so that not escalating may not have been the wrong call, still more arrests would have been nice.Quote:
the topic of race was introduced to this discussion based on the police/security response to the "mob/group/protesters/whatever you want to call them" actions in yesterday's events versus the police/security responses to other "mob/group/protesters/whatever you want to call them" in the recent past.
No - dead is dead and, while that is included as a result of the events, you are not discussing "race issues" in the same perspective as I am. I'm also getting the feeling you are pulling the "trolling" tactics here that you have so readily admitted to doing in the past so... no thanks. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies
Besides, it's also time to get ready for work. I'll try to catch up tomorrow.
Actually, it is about race but in a form of fear. The reporting of the November and the Georgia vote was about white vs those of colour?; the protestors on Capitol on January 6/21 were white or of colour?; the questions comparing the police response to white Supermacists' actions in earlier protests which killed people vs the response to BLM protests; the longterm design and planning of housing to separate race by colour; educational funding by race; incarceration rates by colour; birther questions?;...Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan
The USA has not yet dealt with this continuing undercurrent and the rest of the world reads the reports and books written by American authors detailing the causes, conditions and challenges. Add to this all the additional challenges facing everyone in the world like the pandemic, climate change, etc. I have no desire to become a politician. Many have become so disillusioned with the challenges that they become manipulated by their own self-interest. I admire the Georgia Secretary of State and others who stood for the principle of accuracy despite all the risks.
The so-called coup was staged by white people who have been strongly encouraged to oppose anything other than the memory of the past with the illusion that then things will go back to Make America Great Again. Keeping a state of agitation/chaos in operation was key. It was and is a hypnotic illusion.
The US is not unique in this. Britain has gone through Brexit because too many want things to be the way the remember. It will be interesting to see how that works out as well.
Canada is in it to a similar degree with the aboriginal situation despite Reconciliation efforts but it is being acknowledged as a problem that needs resolution. Getting everyone to see a way ahead has proven illusive. Look at African countries and their issues, the Mid-East with religious conflict, Asia
Human beings seem to thrive on creating criteria and seeing their fellow man/woman as the "other" giving them reasons to behave foolishly.
So I woke up this morning and saw a news report that protesters were wearing shirts that said “6MWE”. The stands for “6,000,000 were not enough”.Quote:
Originally Posted by happystuff
Remember back a few years when I talked about the fear of us going down the same path as Germany did in the 1930s? Many of you pooh-poohed me? Many of you said that we can’t be comparing everything to Hitler? That when we bring up Hitler it just incites arguments and that it’s not comparable? Remember yesterday when I said that this is mostly about racism? Remember how so many of you disagreed with me?
What the hell. I guess I was right.
6MWE = 6 million wasn’t enough
To clarify
Sorry to be dense, but who are the 6M?
I think it’s probably a mistake trying to explain complex events with a simplistic race reductionism. There are too many political and cultural moving parts to think you can understand or address most major issues with such a primitive tool. It’s similar to the distortions Marxists introduce in their focus on class. You become as much a prisoner of your own doctrine as a fundamentalist religious sect trying to explain away evolution.
...Quote:
Originally Posted by catherine
...
...
Glad you aren’t on Reddit asking that…
We love you here and know you are a sincere, brave, and real person. For that reason I will tell you the 6 million refers to the Jews killed by Hitler in World War II.
OK, but I'm not on Reddit. I'm in a "safe space," so who are the 6M?Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies
Maybe I'm becoming all TOO isolated in my island sanctuary.
Despite the cogent arguments of t-shirt based analysis, I still think you’re wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tammy
Can you at least agree that racism is a part of this shameful picture?Quote:
Originally Posted by LDAHL
sorry, I edited my response to give you the answer.Quote:
Originally Posted by catherine
And I think you’re racist. It’s right in front of your face. And you excuse it.Quote:
Originally Posted by LDAHL
I disagreed with the police response necessarily being about racism, this is not about police response. Although police infiltration with far right might be going on as well.
It's 6 million jews, which by the way in u.s. racial categorization are mostly considered, you got it: white people.
You didn’t ask me but sure, I can agree that race plays in some fashion in the whole world of Trumpian politics. If you specifically mean the attempted “coup “maybe but far less so.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tammy
I’m with Ldahl in that I do not respect your opinion drawn from a slogan on one person’s T-shirt. I’m sorry that you can’t see how you’re cherry picking pieces to fit your chosen narrative.
Thank you.Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies
I do, but only a part. But then again, I’m a racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tammy
Modern neuroscience teaches us that everyone is racist. It's encoded into our brains.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tammy
The question is: what do you do about it?
What I do is this: I walk away.
Alan - please delete my profile, etc.
I sincerely wish all of you the best. But I can’t continue.
Tammy, please don't leave! Think of the rest of us that really value your input.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tammy
Good luck, get well, enjoy your retirement, even if not exactly under the circumstances at your choosing (covid).
Well, maybe recently Jews have been considered "white" in America, but....Quote:
Originally Posted by ApatheticNoMore
This right here is one of several reasons why I have a little patience with race education. Like all issues in education, The dominant idea changes.Quote:
Originally Posted by bae
20 -25 years ago we were being taught that racism stems completely from our environment. “No baby is born racist. “ I can’t tell you how many times that was repeated in my education.
So now we find the babies are indeed born racist?
Science. Always believe it. Even when it changes every whipstitch.
Well, if you'd look into the matter, you'd find something interesting about how our brains are constructed. Our brains seem to react differently to "the other", as a matter of wiring. That's not a moral failing.Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies
I've heard that as well. From an evolutionary point of view, we tend to categorize or compartmentalize people or things that may prove to be threats. Once we know that, we can adjust our responses to specific situations.Quote:
Originally Posted by bae
See also "Cat vs. Cucumber"
Is that some primordial fear of snakes at work?Quote:
Originally Posted by bae
Well, when I tried it on my cat, she used the same studious "I don't care, where's my food" look she always has.Quote:
Originally Posted by LDAHL
I won’t look into it further because I believe you. Makes sense to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by bae
What I don’t understand is why the educators of 20-25 years ago in all of the correct-think Kamps I attended did not promote this fact.
Rather than the science of the moment, I am more interested in why this particular science is of THIS moment. How did it come up into our consciousness. How was it and why was it confiscated for the dominant societal outlook, assuming that it is the current thought.
I won’t do a deep dive into this because I don’t have that much interest in it it, But if I run across a good discussion online about my question I will share it here.
As I understand it, some of the research uses technology that only recently has been affordable and accessible for the "soft sciences". In particular, high resolution MRI/neuroimaging voodoo. So, no conspiracy other than "market forces drive down prices and increase availability".Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies
This is really sad. Tammy, your posts are important.Quote:
Originally Posted by catherine
Does this mean I can throw away my class notes and volumes of instructional materials* that were delivered in ponderous tones of “this is so good for us” Lectures? And we can now get to the nitty-gritty of how do we deal with inherent racist attitudes? To me, this seems very freeing to actually get to a place that makes sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by bae
unfortunately the tide has also turned in a way that I don’t like. I wish we could get to a place where, as Alan often states, we look at humans by Martin Luther King‘s criteria not the color of their skin. But I think we’re stuck for a while in this societal mileau where we must view everyone as a color/gender/class/sexual preference object First, and look at their character secondarily.
At least this too will pass. I might be dead by then but that’s OK. Society moves on in how it views things.
*Not really. I certainly don’t mess up my house with reams of this material. Just kidding. But yeah, back in the day, we all came back from our little race workshops clutching our little piles of instructional material.
I think that's how it is going these days in most reasonable places. Certainly the various diversity/inclusiveness trainings and seminars I've been subjected to over the past few years have used that approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by iris lilies