Gen Z is rich, contrary to popular belief

Gen Z has the best economic advantage of previous generations in a long time. Change my mind.

https://www.vox.com/politics/468772/...rs-millennials

This article published by Vox using Federal Reserve statistics from the year 2022 flies in the face of all the doom and gloom we hear about young people not being able to afford anything. They’re too poor to pay off their student loans. They are too poor to buy a house. They just don’t have any economic power!

I had to laugh when I saw one of the explanations for this mindset is they spend too much time on the Internet. No kidding, doomscrolling does a number on your head.

from the article:
“…By most metrics, zoomers are doing better materially than past generations were at the same age.

Take annual income. According to an analysis from the US Federal Reserve, the median 25-year-old zoomer made over $40,000 a year in 2022, after inflation, taxes, and transfers are taken into account. That is 50 percent more than the typical boomer earned at the same age.

Wealth data tells a similar story. As of 2023, Americans born between 1990 and 1999 — in other words, young millennials and older zoomers — had a median net worth that was 39 percent higher (in inflation-adjusted terms) than previous generations boasted at the same age.

Likewise, the median wealth of Americans under 35 in 2022 was the highest on record…”

So let them quit whining and pay their own college loans.

"...As a result, it is much harder for a 25-year-old zoomer to afford a home than it was for boomers at the same age — at least, if the former lacks family money".

What are the expectations for home ownership? I don't know of anyone among my boomer peers that got out of college, worked for a couple of years, and then had enough for a down payment and house payment. Maybe a little different for skilled trades that start saving earlier. And I could get going on work ethics. And get off my lawn, too.

Some of the so called futurists I've read think with AI the day will come when work is optional. I hope my predicted actuarial life span is shorter than those predicted expectations.

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Originally Posted by Rogar

What are the expectations for home ownership? I don't know of anyone among my boomer peers that got out of college, worked for a couple of years, and then had enough for a down payment and house payment. Maybe a little different for skilled trades that start saving earlier. And I could get going on work ethics. And get off my lawn, too.

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We bought our first house in 1979 with a VA loan while attending evening college under the GI Bill, no down payment required on the mortgage. House #2, #3 and #4 were each purchased using regular mortgages and cash down payments from the sale of the previous house. A little sacrifice up front can go a long way.

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Originally Posted by Rogar

"...As a result, it is much harder for a 25-year-old zoomer to afford a home than it was for boomers at the same age — at least, if the former lacks family money".

What are the expectations for home ownership? I don't know of anyone among my boomer peers that got out of college, worked for a couple of years, and then had enough for a down payment and house payment. Maybe a little different for skilled trades that start saving earlier. And I could get going on work ethics. And get off my lawn, too.

Some of the so called futurists I've read think with AI the day will come when work is optional. I hope my predicted actuarial life span is shorter than those predicted expectations.

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We worked for 2 years to scrape up a 20% down payment on our first house….. a definite starter home. We barely had enough for groceries the first few months though. Made a whole lot of things with eggs as I remember. I agree it would be impossible now to afford a down payment.

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Originally Posted by frugal-one

We worked for 2 years to scrape up a 20% down payment on our first house….. a definite starter home. We barely had enough for groceries the first few months though. Made a whole lot of things with eggs as I remember. I agree it would be impossible now to afford a down payment.

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I assume "we' implies a double income, but not always. Two working spouses has advantages. I suspect the average age for males to get married is around 30 these days, a little less a few decades ago.

I bought my first house in 1993, when I was 30 years old. I had already been part of several successful Silicon Valley startups, and I had scrimped and saved for 8 years, and I cashed out enough stock from the company I was working at to come up with the down payment for what was to me at the time an outrageously expensive house in Silicon Valley. I believe the house price was $350k. So, the "Boomers had it easy on housing" meme does not resonate much with me. When I took my first job in Silicon Valley in 1985 right out of college, I was receiving a salary of $22k/year or so, at a very good startup, with an Ivy League degree in the field I was working in, and 4+ years of experience in the fields already under my belt.

I almost lost the house later in the year when Clinton rammed through his retroactive tax increases. I had withheld enough money from my stock sale to properly pay the income tax on the sale when my taxes were due, only to find out that in the new, retroactive(!!!!) tax change, I had to come up with more money for the taxes. Which I didn't have, I was already scraping things together to buy the house. Several of my co-workers lost their homes for the same reason. I still believe the retroactive tax change was unconstitutional, but the courts did not agree.

The house I purchased required 7 years of hard work to turn from the dump it was when I bought it, into a decent place. I probably plowed another $300k into the renovations over that time.

I had room mates after college until my late 20's. We were friends from school and the house was referred to as the home for unwed geologists as a couple room mates were geologists. We were all saving up for a house that none of us cold afford. I rented a small house and lived there for many years with the delusion I could save enough to avoid a mortgage and be debt free without the black hole of interest expenses. I ended up liking renting for some of the home care freedoms and worries it afforded. I travelled a lot. Owning a home and being debt free is the still best of all worlds, other than cleaning the gutters in the fall. My house was a fixer upper when I moved in and is much improved but may still be a fixer upper when I get hauled out.

Lately any little empty lot or space or useless areas are have slightly upscale apartments built, some for sale. There are some city ordinances limiting the number of stories and set back, which are pretty much taken to the limit. I've sent some complaints to the commissioners. That is where a lot of young people are moving that can't afford a real home with a lot. If I were a young person, the freedom and smaller living space might be good. The proposal of a 50 year mortgage was interesting.

Roger, when we moved to a one and a half story house we put Gutter Guard on our gutters. It has helped a lot.

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Originally Posted by iris lilies

Roger, when we move to a one and a half story house we put Gutter Guard on our gutters. It has helped a lot.

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Thanks, IL. It's on my list to check into it with a friend who has them and ask about cost, installer, etc. It wasn't too bad this year, just one of those chores that is unpleasant, but there may come a time when climbing on the roof is a safety issue. I have a lot of leaves and need to run a hose down all the downspouts to clear out the blockages and usually end the day cold and wet.

There are three not-large older houses for sale within a stones throw of me, what I would call starter houses. One of them is actually very nice, a solid arts and crafts era house. The other two are architecturally insignificant, but are solid enough. They have sat on the market for months and I don’t know why. They are not “updated “so maybe they are overpriced? I really don’t know.

but please keep these facts in mind:

1. we are told over and over about the housing shortage in Hermann and how young families can’t find housing
2. the city Council put a moratorium on licenses for bed and breakfast inns and Air bnb properties to address this shortage because out of town owners were buying up small old houses, fixing them up, and they became short term rentals. Now there are more houses available for people to buy for their family home.

So where are the young families who need housing now? They aren’t going after these houses. I don’t get it, but I put some of the blame on them for wanting everything to be new, shiny and updated.

Well we bought our first house when we were both working blue collar jobs at an average starter wage for the time/place, when we were 22. No real skills so no actual "career", just jobs. We bought what we could afford, which meant it needed a lot of TLC. Sold it 9 years later for a larger fixer-upper. Which still needs (re) fixed up, after 30+ years living here. (thank goodness new and shiny is not my thing) During this time, I went back to school, ended up with a masters, and was making a lot more money by the time I retired. DH stayed in a shop, but was making what was to us a decent wage. Even so, our house is currently valued at an amount that would be a real stretch for us to have purchased at the much higher wages we were making when we retired. This even though I feel like we live a in a lower cost of living area. I get that there is a problem out there. I'm guessing that even in GenZ, there is a lot of wage inequality.

I could’ve actually purchased a house on my starting professional salary in Las Cruces NM as a single person back in the day and I did buy one on my second job, the step up job.

I made a cost comparison a couple of years ago on buying a house then and buying a house now in Las Cruces and I won’t reiterate the details, but when I see the salaries for that library, and the kind of houses I would be been interested in, I could afford it now as a single person.

but I will also say that this cost comparison centered on a old house on a posh Street that was very very dated. I would put it up in quality to our Hermann house when we first bought it. And today at my advanced age that is just too outdated for me, but if I were a young person working, it would be fine

DH constantly has to remind me that I expect too much of young people today in their housing requirements. He reminds me that they cannot “update” cosmetics, let alone systems themselves because they don’t have the skills. Also they don’t have money to hire it done. They put all their money into their down payment.so yeah, I suppose from this angle they are screwed.

but then I think about the middle class family who was living in our Hermann cottage with a 1941 kitchen and it was good enough for them, but of course they weren’t Gen Z with high expectations. They were probably younger Gen X.

okay----i got an idea that prolly Herrmann is not an ideal place to live--it's in the middle o' nowhere. Plus-- the people there are too particular about what you can do on your own property for one thing. For another, it's better to live in someplace like Owensville, where at least there is a Supercenter. It's the 21st century, after all. But yeah---gen z's are lazy, and prolly want things turnkey, not fixer-uppers. Yup.

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Originally Posted by littlebittybobby

okay----i got an idea that prolly Herrmann is not an ideal place to live--it's in the middle o' nowhere. Plus-- the people there are too particular about what you can do on your own property for one thing. For another, it's better to live in someplace like Owensville, where at least there is a Supercenter. It's the 21st century, after all. But yeah---gen z's are lazy, and prolly want things turnkey, not fixer-uppers. Yup.

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I think (without having real data ) prices are a little higher in Hermann because it is more desirable than Owensville. there’s more going on, it’s more lively, etc. I cannot compare job opportunities between the two little towns because I just don’t have that data, but we are told all the time that people who want to move to Hermann with jobs cannot find a house to buy so they end up in a nearby community. It’s kind of funny thinking of my little town as having bedroom communities around it, but maybe that’s the case .

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Originally Posted by iris lilies

I think (without having real data ) prices are a little higher in Hermann because it is more desirable than Owensville. there’s more going on, it’s more lively, etc. I cannot compare job opportunities between the two little towns because I just don’t have that data, but we are told all the time that people who want to move to Hermann with jobs cannot find a house to buy so they end up in a nearby community. It’s kind of funny thinking of my little town as having bedroom communities around it, but maybe that’s the case .

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The next time you stalk people in Hermann, be sure and pay attention to the junkyard on Stone Hill Highway, just a stone throw from the beautiful Stone Hill winery and on the route for tour buses. I only WISH residents here were too particular.

okay-----hopefully, the tour buses stop at Casey's on route 19 to get fuel and take a leak and the tour guide will point out the scenario of the shootout between Billy Lee Simpson and the local Gendarme. Maybe have local volunteers stage a re-enactment for the tourists. Yup. Oh, yeah---there's PLENTY to do in Herrmann. Yup.

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Originally Posted by Rogar

Thanks, IL. It's on my list to check into it with a friend who has them and ask about cost, installer, etc. It wasn't too bad this year, just one of those chores that is unpleasant, but there may come a time when climbing on the roof is a safety issue. I have a lot of leaves and need to run a hose down all the downspouts to clear out the blockages and usually end the day cold and wet.

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I have to say I was surprised when DH, Mr.Fixit with the mindset of doing everything himself, agreed to gutter guards. Hevalso hired people to stain the deck. These are not huge jobs, but the gutter clean out is potentially dangerous for an old man on a ladder, and I’ve heard enough stories about old men on ladders. They do not end well.

This is the same DH who worked like a hillbilly for over a year to move every item we own, a 33 year accumulation, from one house to another. He loaded everything himself with one heavy exception and hauled it all in his little truck with its little trailer.This is the same guy who just a few years ago I caught outside, breaking up a concrete patio by himself. That made absolutely no sense to me because our contractor was coming in with heavy equipment to do the same job.

perhaps he is becoming less crazy?

My next door neighbor is 98. They have a small house and I think they get a lot of their home heat with a wood stove. Neighbors and people from his church bring limbs from the tree trimmers or removals and some warm days in winter he's out with a chain saw, axe, and maul and will slowly work away for the better part of an hour. I've asked what his secret is and he says, you have to keep moving. I sometimes think of the chop wood carry water pleasures, but not when cleaning gutters.

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Originally Posted by iris lilies

... the gutter clean out is potentially dangerous for an old man on a ladder, and I’ve heard enough stories about old men on ladders. They do not end well.

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I can confirm. My fire/rescue agency responds to a lot of ladder mishaps. Apparently after A Certain Age, your balance degrades enough that ladders become deadly, plus, falling is harsher on you the older you are.

The medical director of our department advocates that every man over the age of 50 should have their ladders confiscated. We apply his wisdom to our fireground operations, and try to send the younger firefighters up the ladder when roofwork is required. Now that I'm 62, I'm sort of happy about this. (The baseline training for our interior firefighters requires diving out of a 3rd story window in full gear and surviving. There's a trick to this. Don't forget the trick!!!)

My Mom hired a guy for years to do her gutters. Now I hire him on her behalf, and last year was the first year I asked him to put my house on the list, too. DH was a little reluctant, but I didn't have to twist his arm too hard, since apparently it isn't anyone's favorite task. I was thinking about his bad back, heavy ladder, awkward positioning, etc. more than falling, but of course that should probably be the major concern. It's a pretty easy thing to hire out and not terribly expensive.

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Originally Posted by bae

I can confirm. My fire/rescue agency responds to a lot of ladder mishaps. Apparently after A Certain Age, your balance degrades enough that ladders become deadly, plus, falling is harsher on you the older you are.

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Every year I get a short lecture from my doctor about falls and seniors losing balance and supportive muscle. I know of two people who have died of head injuries from short falls. One on stairs, the other just working in the garage, and a third death from a broken hip and no recovery. He sends some of his seniors to a physical or occupation therapist for training and tips on balance, shoes, area rugs, etc. Sarcopenia could be one of the root causes for loss of balance as much as coordination and spacial orientation and is preventable to some degree. I'm finishing up the year with 1800 biking miles, some hiking, and stream wading while fishing, but there is no denying of certain aging conditions.

My gutter guard thoughts are elevated. No country for old men.

One of the many stellar things about DH is that he has always been smart and cautious in his work. He did construction for 20+ years and has nary a nick or scar to show for it. Once many years ago he did fall off a ladder, but no bones were broken, No head injury.

The reason I noticed his caution is because his own father was like a bull in a china shop, a very big guy, reckless In physical work. He was always getting injured. Farm work is dangerous.

DH tells a story where he was out on the farm working with his dad and the old man said “we’re going to cut down that tree and we’re going to do it THIS Way.” DH saw the angle of the proposed job and said “no, I’m not doing that, it’s dangerous.”

His father insisted on his own method. DH smartly just walked away rather than argue.

The old man came up to him some minutes later, clutching his arms saying “we’ve got to go to the hospital. I broke my arm.” Oops. There are stories of the old guy driving supplies in battle zones in the Korean war. He was loved by his superiors because he took enormous risks to get difficult jobs done.

I didn’t marry a risk taker, I like it that way.

About falls:

I figure I have a few more years before I have to get rid of the throw rugs around my house. Now I like them because they provide spots of color, but I already trip over them occasionally and catch myself. In a while, I won’t be able to catch myself.


Gardeners tend to be better with balance and agility than the average senior citizen, but I haven’t done heavy duty gardening for two years now, so I’ve lost all of that physical acuity.

This spring I put my foot down and told DH he HAD TO INSTALL THE RAILING on the stairway to the basement, DAMMIT!! because I wasn’t going to go through yet another year without a railing. He did it.

I have grab bars in my bathroom bathtub, but since I hadn’t used them before, I didn’t really know where to put them and ended up not putting them where I would actually use them. I suppose I could add one in the right place later.

Back to the original topic, there is no comparison from generation to generation what is considered affordable. My parents generation: WW2, when dad got out son about three, went to college on GI bill. Baby numbers 2;3 and 4 soon after and we lived n a tiny two bedroom house, one bathroom. But middle class for then lifestyle. No TV, no internet, one car, one phone in kitchen. We walked and rode bikes everyehere.
my generation: Vietnam protests, don’t give into the man, eloped and headed to California. More cars, bigger houses, fewer kids and more technology totally changed everything.traffic starting to ramp up.

My kids: lots of computers, cable TV, way more aware outside of our town. Values continue to change as divorce became common and people moved around the country for work.two cars, fast food joints all over the lace.
Grandkids :bombarded by social media, influencers, 24/7 information thrown at them at dizzying speeds. Grew up used to kids having way more access to car rides, vacations etc. movies that were rated x now on day time cable. Vulgar and sex violent shows on all day.

each generation faced different exposures, different societies and expectations. PLUS THE tv ads, betting on sports, food available 24/7 Middle class shrinking, union jobs and pensions rare, and health care premiums skyrocketing. The wealth gap continually increasing here in 7.50 minimum wage Florida.

no wonder why these kids don’t realize what the life we had, way simpler and way more frugal could actually be fun and fulfilling. They are missing a lot.