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  1. #1
    Senior Member flowerseverywhere's Avatar
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    Student loan forgiveness

    I just don't get it. This was one of the contentious issues in the recent debt ceiling fight.
    I know not one person who thinks this is a good idea except for perhaps people who staffed the hospitals and ambulances tirelessly could have been rewarded with a program like this. Most think the moratorium should have been much shorter. Especially when things started opening up and help wanted signs were everywhere.

    Its not pleasant to pick up extra hours when you are working, but millions of students work their way through school, Work full time and take a few courses at a time, attend community college and live at home, parents like me worked extra hospital to help them, and none of these are easy.

    So I hope somebody can explain it to me, as the debt ceiling raise might have been easier to get through. it just doesn't make any sense as many many people would love to attend university full time and live there, however are not willing to pay exorbitant costs and take massive loans.

  2. #2
    Senior Member iris lilies's Avatar
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    When you say you know not one person in favor of student loan forgiveness, please know your personal anecdotal polling is insufficient.

    This poll by the Cato institute shows 64% of Americans are in favor of at least some student loan forgiveness, and Cato is not exactly a friend to the AOC’s of the world. Not surprisingly, 88% of those who currently hold student loans covered by this proposed program are in favor of student loan forgiveness.

    I doubt that you will find anyone to explain it to you here on this website since this is a small group of people who are frankly pretty old. We could have our own poll I suppose, but jeppy can only vote once! Did you hear me jep? Ha ha I’m just pulling your chain. Ultralight Angler no longer comes to our website but he would probably be a “yes “vote.

    https://www.cato.org/blog/new-poll-7...ied%20couples.

  3. #3
    Senior Member JaneV2.0's Avatar
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    In principle, I was in favor of the deal where you worked off your debt by doing the employment equivalent of community service--in certain "helper" fields. But apparently, that was badly mismanaged. Otherwise, I'd be in favor of low-interest student loans and counseling to help prospective debtors see the light before they saddled themselves with massive loans. I'm also strongly in favor of cheap or free community college. I think much of Europe has the right idea--a well-educated population is a valuable investment.

    (I worked my way through college at a time when state college was mostly affordable to all.)

  4. #4
    Yppej
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    The long term fix is to stop requiring people to have unnecessary paper credentials for jobs.

    If you really need a credential (lawyer, doctor) you can earn enough to pay for it.

    The problem is employers requiring it when it's not needed. Then they wonder why they can't get help in the midst of a labor shortage. Why work a low wage job when if you are unemployed you get a pause on your payments?

  5. #5
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    I wonder how the results would look if the question were “Would you support the transfer of college debt liabilities from the original debtors to the general public?”

  6. #6
    Senior Member flowerseverywhere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LDAHL View Post
    I wonder how the results would look if the question were “Would you support the transfer of college debt liabilities from the original debtors to the general public?”
    The survey IL referenced that. If it raised taxes, made colleges charge more or made more businesses require it, far fewer people approve it. You know it is OK to fund stuff, but not if my own taxes go up type of thinking.

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    What I don't see anyone addressing is the banks. The banks are making money hand over fist with loans. I had a National Defense Education Act loan for 1 year of college in 1969. I taught in a title 1 school and each year there my loan interest was reduced as was my principle. My $3000 loan was reduced to $1500. We were told that defaulting on that would reduce the amount of people who could get that loan. I'm pretty sure at that time the Feds ran it, not private banks. It was only for tuition and room and board and I don't think I ever saw money, it went right to the school. I do think banks have been taking advantage of these loans for years.

  8. #8
    Senior Member littlebittybobby's Avatar
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    Okay---I already gave my 2 cents on this, and don't have the time to give the convoluted explanation to justify why this is one demmacrat public policy I can agree with. Because see----most ideologues for- --and particularly against the proposal tend to oversimplify it; mainly because they don't see it as THEIR problem. One of my case studies joined the military right after high school, spent the next 20+ years in the Navy, re-entered civilian life in another very structured occupation, and draws his pension and benefits and so on. He's a patridiotic flag-waver, who supports our troops. He detests the idea of loan forgiveness. Yup. But yeah---if you said "lets cut entitlements for veterans, because they were just serving their country like any patriot should, regardless of any economic gain" , why---he'd go berserk like an antifa demonstrator! Yup. But in my view, most defense spending is a colossal example of waste. Yup. So anyway---he is typical of mosta the hard-assed reactionary types who oppose discounting student loan balances. Which is what it is---a discount, on a way overpriced service that has been rendered by mostly "non-profit" organizations, also highly- subsidized by govverment and private donors, and for-profit diploma mills, as well. What is happening is,, you are putting Those People(students) in a Debtors' Prison without walls, where they don't get 3 hotts and a cot, like common criminal thugs do. The banks are adding interest and the gubmint is claiming tax refunds, etc. See? It was a grand experiment to hand out E-Z loans the way they did, to naive young people, and we see the outcome. It needs to change, so this won't continue to happen. They owe their souls to the company store. As I've said before(and I read this in the newspaper), tuition at our local post-sec schools has inflated something on the order of 10x in the last 30 years! But what's new in the world of ABC's and 123's? Not a whole lot. But the Universe-ities are expanding, with more and more useless subjects! Yup. It's a racket.
    So anyway---give the kids a break, and a nice discount on the tuition they can't pay off, and write it off. Yup. Hope that helpps you some.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Teacher Terry's Avatar
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    People need financial counseling before they take out student loans. Owing a bunch of money for a worthless degree is not smart. I am against loan forgiveness unless it’s related to a career that’s needed such as agreeing to teach in a low income school for a number of years in exchange. This agreement needs to be in writing in advance of obtaining the money. Then upon graduation the student can comply with the terms or pay the loan back.

  10. #10
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    Well, I am Old, but when I went to college in 1969, tuition at state colleges in California was roughly $180/ year. My books were $150. That was the cost of college: $330/yr. Post Viet Nam war era, most of the men were using VA education benefits. The women were either still living with their parents, or working hard to pay to live elsewhere. And minimum wage was $1.35. There was very little “living in the dorms.” If you commuted, you shared rides, even though gas was 23 cents a gallon. Parking on campus was scarce and cost $1 for 4 hours! A parking ticket was $25!!

    I didn’t/don’t know anyone who had a “student loan.” We paid as we went, or didn’t go. Period.

    Graduate school, for me to get my teaching credentials and masters degree 12 years later, was a similar story. Found a program with late afternoon/ evening classes so I could continue to work full time during first semester and summer session. Took a 4-month leave and financed second semester with credit card. Got my credential and Master’s end of May, went back to work full time through the summer, had card paid off by the time I started teaching in September.

    Some were along the line, late 90s early 2000s, parents started indulging their kids by “sending them away to college.” Ha! Sounds like a parent perk to me, get the kids out of the house, be free to travel etc. Often loans were involved, easy to get loans. Soon the parents were mightily in debt, now the students themselves had to sign for the loans.

    Kids signing big loans, what could possibly go wrong? Turns out, a whole lot. The economy tanked, interest accrued, but people kept asking and banks kept granting student loans, even when they weren’t making car loans or home loans. Big loans, whose fault/responsibility? Parents were used to money flowing easily, and Education is such a worthwhile investment. Not any more, as it turns out.

    The economy crashed, turned out the jobs didn’t pay so well after all the inflation, but banks kept extending credit because they had student loans…

    I think the BANKS should pick up their share of responsibility in this mess. Rewrite the loan to the existing principle plus 5% non- compounding interest. Let these people get out from under this mess, that they got into by trusting their parents and the System. It’s all just paper anyway.

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