Discipline. (Growing up and as a parent).

Margene's thread- (dealing with passive aggressive spouse) posted under the Family Matters & Relationships forum along with an entry of mine I made in response to her topic made me think, "how was discipline handled in your home"? (Both growing up and when you became a parent).

Spankings? Groundings? Restricted use of electronic devices/television watching/etc? Taking into consideration the age group of this forum I'm assuming (back then) both parents took part in the deliverance of discipline, but how about you as a parent? Did you have the support of your spouse when it came to discipline, or did you go it alone like me?

My dad always worked (outside the home) when I was growing up so mom was the disciplinarian in our home. Spanking was at the top of her list when it came to reining us kids in and correcting us, standard for the time. (Late 50's, 1960's).

As a parent I was the sole disciplinarian in our home, DH wanted nothing to do with it. (I hate the divide of a one parent disciplinarian role). I think it can and does generate a divide as to what parent the children feel more love for or respect for. I'm happy to say no divide was ever established in our home (to the best of my knowledge), but still.

ETA: I used spanking (pants dustings) with all my kids except the last two, along with a host of other restrictive measures.

Both my wife and I participate in disciplinary measures, and make sure to consult frequently to make sure we are on the same page to prevent inconsistencies.

We have never used any manner of physical discipline. My wife and I are both pacific, though not pacifists, and do not approve of the initiation of violence except in self-defense of self or others. This extends to harsh words, throwing pans, slamming doors, stomping off, and other such things.

We do impose consequences, and communicate clearly ahead of time with our oh-too-clever offspring what our expectations are, and what the consequences are for trouble. No waffling, no do-overs, justice is swift, impartial, and relentless :-)

Now and then, especially as we are in the teen years, there is testing. So far, so good - I think the secret is our constant open communication between all parties, and our discussions ahead of any incidents, so that everyone is clear.

I like bae's inclusion of door slamming and stomping off as violence. They are certainly behaviours that indicate a particular frame of mind and suggest that the person might like to slam or stomp YOU. I think I'll add them to my list of "not really okay" ways to behave for teens. They are not okay for adults in our house, so there isn't any logical reason why a child should have a different set. The child, by the way, is fourteen. Thanks!

I tend to sympathize most with the natural consequences school of discipline (show kids the natural consequences of their actions) although I'm not sure how well it works in practice. Hey, I'm not a parent. (And even I wouldn't let my kids, if I had them, run out into the street to find out the natural consequences of *that*. Physical safety trumps all such principles).

Discipline growing up: many times we got away with murder (well not literal murder of course, but permissiveness yea). A few rare times I got a spanking when parents had decided they were being too permissive and swung the other way. A few times I had to eat soap for some words that came out of my mouth. Sometimes a parent would erupt into violent rage at our misbehavior (and you feared for you life then, if you knew what was good for you, you hid and ducked and covered because anything could happen in those rages). Sometimes they'd say absolutely horrible things about us when we misbehaved (about us as people, not just our behavior). Sometimes there were attempts at groundings that were never enforced. Always there was shame and being made to feel like a bad person. Shame was so dominant in that house that, hmpf, you know I tend to near totally reject shame altogether as an adult. I don't think I could do a worse job at discipline than my parents if I wanted to!!! Permissiveness is not actually the worst discipline style out there.

Sadly, children who are not physically punished and who are subject to logic and reason as a discliplinary measure just turn into Republicans as my liberal Democratic (party) parents found. Both me and my brother dispapointed our mother. I'm sure it was her style of discipline.:laff:

Nice to hear from you Bae. Parental sharing is something I would have really liked to have when my kids were young. Just being able to sit down and consult with one another as to the proper approach and consequence (discipline related) would have been such a blessing. I am happy to report that one thing in our house has changed since then, now that the older kids are older and bigger, my husband has taken on a more proactive roll in what does and doesn't happen now, and that in itself has been a warm welcome. It's allowed me to let go a bit and play spectator in the bleachers for a change.

Leslieann. My second oldest daughter will be 14 this year.

ApatheticNoMore. I relate to so much of the upbringing you speak of. It really was such a different time back then wasn't it. I'm glad in many ways to see those days past. I like the style of parenting I see nowadays (for the most past), although there are still times I feel some kids need more.

Iris. Just caught your post! LMAO! I fall under the same crowd as you. :) By the way Iris, check out our posting times. 7:52!

Disciplining our children comes much more naturally to my husband. I am more of a softy, but have seen how it has paid off with our older son and do my best (even though it is out of my comfort zone.) In the meantime, I like to think I've also influenced him finding ways to be more patient with both of our sons. We really look at this parenting thing like we are a team and we've bonded over sticking together.

Hi Karla. Thanks for dropping by. I've always been somewhat of a softy too, always have been, however my firm side did have a way of shining through at times when needed. In reading Bae's and your entries, I too can relate now to a more tighter and closer bond I have with my husband now that we're both involved with the discipline side of things in our home. It just makes things that much more easy. Never should one parent (in a two parent home) be burdened with the responsibility of doling out discipline while the other parent looks the other way.

P.S. I'll be sure to check out you blog just as soon as I can!

hehehehe.....maybe it works in reverse as well, Iris Lily......I come from quite a rock ribbed Republican family who really modeled what bae describes as the parenting style of he and his wife, although my father, not retired, was seldom home. And look......I ended up being a Democrat.

Gotta watch those Republican homes....they have an unfortunate tendency to produce liberals, hahahaha. Maybe it's like all those heterosexual homes producing all those gay kids. Something MUST be done......

sorry...just kind of feeling silly.......

raised my kids as bae describes.....ended up with one liberal and one conservative Republican Fox News aficionado.......

just not a fan of spanking....but very much a fan of presenting a united front. Kids are born adept manipulators, so are quick to take advantage of any "cracks" in the system.

LMAO LC! Hmmm, points to ponder. (Thinking of my own kids now after what you and Iris said). :) It's funny, but long before I had children I had a pretty fair idea as to how I was going to raise them, and holding true to one of my strong convictions came spanking, however after a life-altering/changing event related to my youngest son along with the kindheartedness and care of a few of the members (old forum) to help direct me towards a new path and leave spanking behind me, I scratched it off my list of favoured methods. Last spanking in our house, oh, about 3 (or so) years ago!

My parents were fans of physical punishment, shouting, groundings, washing mouths out with soap, throwing things and generally just instilling fear into us. And I was scared of my dad, in particular. Any little thing would set him off. He's much calmer now and I know he regrets being so quick-tempered with us. His father was the same, so I suppose he just naturally took on those behaviours. I'm only 27, so it was hardly all that long ago.

I remember one time when I was maybe six or seven, I rubbed my dad's toothbrush in the soap after he'd made me 'wash out my mouth' with it. He was not pleased. :)

Having taught kids of all ages, I know how easy it is for me to lose my temper when they misbehave... BUT I also practised being conscious of this and trained myself to take a calmer approach and see the lighter side of it all. I don't have any kids of my own yet, but let's just say I do NOT want them to be scared of me or feel they are constantly walking on eggshells (as I did...). And I'm certainly not going to vent my own lack of control/frustration on them by resorting to physical violence. Fortunately my partner is a very calm man who never raises his voice, so hopefully he'll help me out!

Good morning Mira. Reining kids in back in the day really was over the top wasn't it. I still see parents coming completely unglued and unhinged while out in public. Somehow, even though it's not me making a spectacle of myself, I still feel embarrassed.

My mom was sort of like that with us kids. She'd fly off the handle and go on a tirade of sorts, hollering and laying down the law. I sometimes think she actually woke up certain mornings and said to herself, "today is the day". LOL!

The most memorable (and funny) escapade was when baby brother was around nine or ten and mom went in to give him a "what for". She had the spanking stick (paddle) in her hand and only got to #2 on the spanking count when the stick broke! I should mention, baby brother was no longer a baby, he was well on his way to becoming a big boy and he promptly laughed mom right out of his room!!! :laff: It was a victory of sorts for us kids. We ALL had a good laugh that day!

Sometimes I blame my own upbringing on why I used spanking with my first four kids. (Monkey see- monkey do mentality). But with me I was more the "huff and puff type". (Lots of posturing and kicking up dust)! LMAO! Then occasionally a spank or two on a padded butt. Nothing serious. So glad those days are behind me now.

Sounds like we have identical husbands. My husbands presence is more than enough to settle anyone down, such a teddy bear he is. Sometimes my oldest daughter can get pretty excited and she'll get standoffish with my husband, and in a quiet and passive voice my husband will say- "honey, that's just the way it is". The end. :)

My parents were pretty strict. But I know that mom could spank both me and my brother, but dad could only spank my brother. I still don't like those bouncy balls tied to a paddle toys because that was what my mom used. I think after about age 8 discipline transfered to more farm chores and when I was rebellious in high school it was either grounding me from my truck or if I'd been drinking at a party I'd get an early wake-up call from my dad to join him in the woods for a day of cutting firewood (chainsaw and hangover is punishment enough).

Discipline with my boys has been different. I can really only remember 2 times I actually spanked one of the boys and I only used my hand. I tend to lean towards the adding extra chores if needed but to be honest these guys make a lot better choices than I did growing up. We'll see what happens in the next few years - I'm sure there will be something to put us to the test.

I was never spanked and I can honestly say I've never heard my mom raise her voice to anyone, ever. (And she's not a meek person.) My dad didn't spank either. He did raise his voice, but it was rare...and you wanted to be FAR AWAY when it happened. I would describe my parents as strict about our behavior, but they didn't hit or berate us into compliance. I do remember my parents "grounding" me from certain friends and activities....and they were right to do so, but I don't really recall any other punishment. When I started going down a wrong path as a teen, they both made sure I was busy doing other things to keep me away from the trouble. They saved me from problems in their own strong and quiet way, and in hindsight I'm seeing they were really good at it.

Since I wasn't spanked as a child, it doesn't occur to me to spank my kids. I've never had the urge to hit them. My husband was spanked quite a bit as a kid and there has been times when he struggled with the urge to spank. I give him lots of credit for breaking that cycle. Unlike my mom, I do raise my voice on occasion. My DH rarely raises his voice, but he lectures on and on and on and on and on blah blah blah blah blah. (I don't think the lecturing is effective, but that's his style and I leave him to it.)

Good morning Float On and Bootsie! FO. The bouncy ball-paddle toy story made me laugh! Those seemed to be R-E-A-L-L-Y popular among moms when I was growing up! Those, and wooden paint sticks! :)

Sometimes I'd get on a- "I'm going to whip you guys into shape" kick. (Untidy/messy rooms were my thing). I'd march said kid or kids off to their room(s) (more so the boys) and after seeing them into their jungles, I'd give them a stern warning. "You got 5 minutes to get this pigsty cleaned up- or else"! Then I'd go have a cigarette and 5 or 10 minutes later return and get down on my hands and knees and help them!!! LMAO! So much for my strictness! :laff:

Always used my hand whenever I spanked too. (Just enough to knock the dust out of ones pants)! ROTFLMAO! Diapered butts were the best. Lots of padding and those rubber pants popped the loudest drum-beat!!! The other kids would scatter when they heard that sound! Ha-ha-ha!!!

Bootsie. I don't recall much in the way of groundings or restrictions as a kid, and dad pretty much stayed out of it (things), allowing mom to take hold of the reins and do as she pleased- and do as she pleased she did! LMAO!

When I hear stories of parents breaking the spanking cycle, that makes me happy. :) It's so easy carrying on from where ones parents left-off. Tradition, at least for me is/was such a strong temptation. However, when I dropped "pants dustings" in my home and redirected my focus on using other forms and means of bringing my kids back in line, the results were miles better than the old, so there really is something to be said about spank-free homes. Definitely builds a more healthy environment.

P.S. More and more I'm really liking the added or extra chore(s) rule. I'm going to work on that one and tailor a program specifically for use in my own home. Thanks for that!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mrs-M

My mom was sort of like that with us kids. She'd fly off the handle and go on a tirade of sorts, hollering and laying down the law. I sometimes think she actually woke up certain mornings and said to herself, "today is the day". LOL!

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This cracked me up!

Hi Mira. Laughs are always good, and that's what I was hoping for with this thread. A chance for all those who are interested to drop by for a chat and to share their experiences and methods and ways. This has been a really helpful and enjoyable thread.

Discipline when I was growing up was mostly spankings and groundings. Arbitrary punishments that taught us nothing other than how to avoid getting caught. Dh had a similar experience during his childhood.

When my son came along we decided that we were going to do something different. We opted to make sure that discipline actually ment the teaching of something. So when we disciplined it was a skill building action. Something that taught our child to do better then next time he encounted a similar situation. Instead of arbitary punishments which teach nothing, we chose instead to allow natural/logical consequences to fall where they may and held our son to the making of restitution for his mistakes. If he broke the rule regarding the use of his cell phone then he lost the priveleges for a time. With that came the need to make restitution by paying for extra charges out of is own pocket.

When younger, if he broke a lamp because he chose to use the couch as a trampoline, he would loose the privelege of sitting on the couch for awhile. He'd have to sit on the floor, on a bean bag chair, kitchen chair etc.. but not the couch. He'd also be responsible for paying for the repair or replacement of the lamp.

Dh and I are on the same page so that helps.

Ds is now 17 and a HS senior. This method still works effectively and ds respects our decisions regarding restitution. Natural/logical consequences also help him to see the need for the rules and to respect them as well. Most recently (about a year ago) we had a problem with him not getting home when expected with the car. He lost driving priveleges and for a while had to have us drive him around.

Hi Artist. I like consequences over punishments way better too. (Noticed big change with my kids when I introduced consequence). With my last three kids I used consequences with them (more so than the other kids) and sweet success it was.

My kids all liked going shopping with me because 9 times out of 10, they got a treat or spoiled in some way or another while out, but misbehaving got them restricted to the house under the care of a babysitter and no treats or spoiling. I think I may have instated my- "you'll be staying at home today with the sitter" clause twice. :) Quick learners they were! :laff:

The bonus part (for me) regarding consequence, was that it was so rewarding for me to hand-down. Oh how I hated spanking! Sounds like you're on the right track. So nice to see. :) Thank you so much for dropping by and sharing.

I think I was only spanked a couple of times and I'm 48 so that was when spanking was more common. My mom yelled a lot but there were five of us so maybe it wasn't all that much in comparison to the number of kids. And I don't remember any of this being traumatic. Somehow around my dad we just behaved. I don't know why. Although I loved my dad. I was always kinda shy around him.

I think we are strict but fair. We're consistant about what we discipline for, but the actual consequence depends on the situation, age and kid. Most of it is pretty logical and I try to recognize external factors that could be affecting behaviour without excusing the behaviour. I expect a pretty high level of good behaviour.

Here's an example. The kids have had a tough couple of weeks with me on bedrest and being in and out of the hospital. They've had a lot of different people in the house helping take care of them and they are out of their routine. They haven't gotten out of the house as much as usual and people have been letting them do things they don't do on a regular basis, like watch TV and skip their chores. Now my mom is here and things are getting on a more consistant footing, but we've had a few conflicts to iron out.

Yesterday Zach was planning to take the kids to an indoor climbing place when Bella got out of school. We hadn't told them this because things are minute-to-minute here and we didn't want them to be bummed if I had to go to the hospital again. In the morning Cheyenne had an attitude about not being allowed to watch TV (which is not normally allowed on weekdays) and started crying about how it wasn't fair and we were so mean. I sat her down. I told her calmly and matter-of-factly that she needed to take a deep breath and stop crying. We don't cry over not getting what we want and she knows better than that. TV is gone for the next seven days, no arguing. It's a priviledge, not a right and if it causes a problem it's going to be gone completely.

I explained that Daddy had something planned for the evening, but that I couldn't reward her current behaviour by letting him take her, so I needed her to turn things around and show me better behaviour. I told her that I wanted her to be able to go and I thought it would help with the restlessness and boredom she's had lately, but at this point it needed to be earned. I outlined what it was she could do to redeem herself and show me that she was serious about turning this around. In this case I assigned her to her grandma to help with chores. She had to cheerfully do whatever Grandma asked her to do until Grandma said she was done.

Grandma had her help clean the kitchen, living room and downstairs bathroom. Cheyenne's attitude changed completely. She was enthusiastic about showing us how good she could be and she was proud of herself for accomplishing something when she was done. She got to go to the indoor climbing place and as expected it has helped. The kids got nice and worn out, got a good night sleep and have been in much better, more cooperative moods today.

Hi Margene and Stella. You're right Margene, it really was the way back then. I'm glad times have changed. (The only thing traumatic (kid traumatic) in my life related to discipline/spanking, was when mom marched us into the bathroom "two", "three", and sometimes even "four" at a time to be punished. Being last in line was the worst. Having to stand and endure waiting and watching everyone ahead of you getting a whoopin knowing yours was a comin! Funny part is, mom says she wouldn't spank again if she were raising a family today.

Stella. Great story. Great results. :) I often reflect on how smart kids actually are and, how many parents fail to recognize the fact. Options, consequences, and even simple calm reasoning/explaining IMV (in my view) wins over old-fashioned discipline tenfold. One thing that really helped me so much, was having older children when the younger ones came along. As minute (minuscule) as one may think, older children have a real influence on the younger ones in a family. With my two youngest, they love to mimic the grownup mannerisms and behaviour of my oldest son, and combined with the input and direction my two daughters dovetail in, it's a win- win situation for not only me (the parent), but for the kids too. By far (for their age), my two youngest are miles ahead of what any of my other four kids were ever at during that age/stage.

By the way Stella, you were one of the original members (old forum) who helped me move past my old-fashioned discipline style and over to a more modern effective way. You, Kathy WI, Kathymuggle (remember her)?, and so many others I have now forgotten, but what I've never forgotten is the care and input and direction you all so lovingly put forth to help me recognize better ways. :)