White house report on climate change

[bae]

I foolishly decided a few years ago to look with my own eyes.

I went on an expedition to the shore of the Arctic Ocean (admittedly, in my diesel-fueled Hummer H1).

I made it to Tuktoyaktuk:



There I found considerable evidence of a qualitative change in permafrost characteristics in the region, and erosion of native sites that had been there for thousands of years, caused by increased storm strength and open ocean fetch.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/tu...hange-1.845397


Clearly there is *something* going on, and I believe it is reasonable to be prudent.

Now, here where I live, I have hairshirt greenies demanding we restrict building within 20 feet elevations of high high tide, because of "sea level rise predictions". I think they are not so interested in preservation, as prevention of human activity within the shoreline region.

[catherine]

I also believe that contrary opinions have a lesser chance of being presented in peer reviewed journals than Condoleezza Rice has of being universally welcomed to speak at Rutgers. Academia doesn't have a stellar reputation for diversity of opinion.

I would totally agree with you on that one.. and, just as an aside, being a Rutgers Alum parent twice over I am really disheartened by the University community's treatment of Condoleeza Rice.

[iris lilies]

Sometimes in an idle moment I wonder what activities the pious green brigade will partake in when they've converted everyone to their point of view. All of the marching and scolding and Occupying has got to take up a lot of their time. When the Recalcitrant Deniers come 'round to right thinking, what then?

I totally get that it is easier to rail on people via the internet than it is to, oh, I don't know, give up a car.

[ApatheticNoMore]

I totally get that it is easier to rail on people via the internet than it is to, oh, I don't know, give up a car.

is it easier or harder to give up a car than to lobby say city hall for greener policies? And does it matter if something accomplishes something or only how hard it is? Digging holes and filling them up again might also be very hard ... and contribute as much to fighting climate change as giving up one's car perhaps.

I can't imagine getting involved in the nitty gritty of politics (not debating politics for the intellectual exercise, I mean actual activism) in the world such as it us (not some utopia democracy where it's endlessly gratifying) as something anyone would choose because it's the most enjoyable way to spend their free time. Although the people involved in such are far more likely to give up their car (because the only other reason I've seen people around here give one up besides environmental concern is because they are flat out broke pretty much).

I guess pious may drive some people, but what I'd prefer to do on earth is just to explore it (and the universe if so inclined), and build human solutions yea but focused on human problems. But if the earth is deteriorating around one, posing a threat not just to natural beauty but to who knows how many species in existence INCLUDING your own, it may make other action seem desirable/necessary. Caring about other peoples thoughts requires a strong belief that one can change them (maybe some people. but denialists? I really think why bother even debating them) and a strong belief that the reason public policy is messed up is because of mass opinion (because other people's views only cause problems (rather than just annoyances) if they affect that which you and others share with them ... like say the planet for instance).

[Charlie WA]

I recently watched the movie Soylent Green from 1973. The story took place in New York City in the year 2022. The earth had gotten warmer due to "the greenhouse effect". I wondered how many other people were thinking about the consequences of a warmer earth in back in 1973. Here is a short clip from the movie on YouTube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xo7yZ9kG9A

[razz]

The Archdruid talks about just this issue and the thinking of the 70's in his blog at: http://thearchdruidreport.blogspot.ca/

Lots of information that is quite interesting in his blog if you look at the archives.

[Rogar]

Sometimes in an idle moment I wonder what activities the pious green brigade will partake in when they've converted everyone to their point of view. All of the marching and scolding and Occupying has got to take up a lot of their time. When the Recalcitrant Deniers come 'round to right thinking, what then?

I totally get that it is easier to rail on people via the internet than it is to, oh, I don't know, give up a car.

It's ironic that people on a simple living forum would be critical of the greeny lifestyle. In practice they share many of the same ideals around reduced consumption and living with less as was idealized in YMOYL. The motives are different, but very compatible.

[Alan]

It's ironic that people on a simple living forum would be critical of the greeny lifestyle.

Oh, I don't know about that. Simple living means different things to different people. Let's take me for example:
I became interested in the concept of simple living in the late 90's when I started becoming dis-illusioned with my career path. The hours, the workload, the dedication which must be maintained in order to continue advancing, etc. I started thinking more and more about quality of life and how it could be enhanced. It had nothing to do with an ideology such as "the greeny lifestyle".

Individuals are unique, how boring would it be if we all had to follow the same path.

[Rogar]

Well, if you look at the Amazon summary of YMOYL, these are bullet items. "get out of debt and develop savings. reorder material priorities and live well for less. resolve inner conflicts between values and lifestyle. save the planet while saving money". Though I respect the idea that simple living may be different for people, those are the values the book presents.

[Alan]

Gosh, I hope I don't get kicked out of the club for not prioritizing properly.