Baltimorei

[Gregg]

What I am saying catherine, is that I think our primitive wiring IS set up for "Them versus us" in many instances. Like racial profiling........If you have the same "type" of person who tends to act a certain way, you'd be naive to not have that filed in the back of your mind as something you should be cautious/distrustful of. I like my primitive wiring.....it keeps me safe/alive. But I realize that to be "civilized" we have to try to rise above those leanings. (whether good or bad).

I see the desire/need to achieve the "preservation of us" which is not necessarily "them versus us" unless we all want the same thing and there isn't enough to go around. Somehow the beasts of the savannah have worked out a system where they can all get a drink of water. It is humans that feel the need to 'own' the water rather than share it even though there is plenty of this metaphorical water to go around.

Competition is a wonderful thing because it is a driver for excellence and innovation, but the "versus" part is just greed. Why do I need more than you? Why does my tribe need to have more than yours? Its sad to think that we seem to so rarely achieve great things that don't come at the expense of someone else.

[catherine]

Coincidentally, I just got this article, "How White People Got Made" in my email. It's hard to find a pithy excerpt, but basically it outlines the historical American events and political decisions that created this gulf between blacks and whites.

https://medium.com/message/how-white...e-6eeb076ade42

[LDAHL]

I see the desire/need to achieve the "preservation of us" which is not necessarily "them versus us" unless we all want the same thing and there isn't enough to go around. Somehow the beasts of the savannah have worked out a system where they can all get a drink of water. It is humans that feel the need to 'own' the water rather than share it even though there is plenty of this metaphorical water to go around.

Competition is a wonderful thing because it is a driver for excellence and innovation, but the "versus" part is just greed. Why do I need more than you? Why does my tribe need to have more than yours? Its sad to think that we seem to so rarely achieve great things that don't come at the expense of someone else.

Who gets to decide what is "fair share" and what is "greed".

[CathyA]

catherine........I respect your view of things, but I don't have a great need to feel that I'm in any way connected to certain other people. The human race, as far as I'm concerned has done nothing but destroy things. I think we're a mutation, a blight upon this beautiful earth. It's as if we don't even belong here.
And, by the way, I don't feel negatively about all other races. In my experience, I might have had very good interactions with certain ethnicities, and I might have had bad ones. I respond to that.
I feel pretty hopeless about relying on humans to fix just about anything in a good way. I'm actually much more connected to nature than to humans.
I think some differences/conflicts are unsolvable.......which is fine if we can live apart from each other. But we can't.

[catherine]

Who gets to decide what is "fair share" and what is "greed".

I think it's probably like that Supreme Court quote about obscenity: you know it when you see it. You see a kid who shares and you see a greedy brat.. don't you know the difference? Maybe you can't legislate it, but you can find ways to support or condone one vs the other in society. You can value one vs. the other. Our culture elevates greed to the level of virtue.

[CathyA]

I think it's probably like that Supreme Court quote about obscenity: you know it when you see it. You see a kid who shares and you see a greedy brat.. don't you know the difference? Maybe you can't legislate it, but you can find ways to support or condone one vs the other in society. You can value one vs. the other. Our culture elevates greed to the level of virtue.

But isn't that what the capitalistic system is all about, and what is number one on this country's list of what's important/essential/vital/blah, blah, blah?

[bae]

And I guess I am a racist, since I believe that cultures/peoples from different geographical areas, etc., ARE different.....and very likely in their DNA.

You are correct. That is a racist point of view.

Culture isn't carried in the DNA in humans.

Question: if someone is only half-darkie, will their culture be OK? How about 1/4? Or 1/8? When does the taint of the blood go away?

[LDAHL]

Our culture elevates greed to the level of virtue.

I think you're being unfair to "our culture" (if such a thing exists). I have served in uniform with good people willing to endure everything from inconvenience and indignity to mortal danger to protect their country, and they weren't in it for the money. I work every day with people who chose public service over the maximum paycheck. My daughter's school exists because families are willing to make the financial and time sacrifices needed to provide the best education they can. I serve on the board of directors of an organization that builds houses for families that might not otherwise afford one (nobody involved is getting rich, I'll tell you that). This board you're posting on gives the lie to the concept of greed as a virtue.

Are there people who prioritize material gain? Sure. Let them. Everyone should have a right to chart his own course and live with the consequences. But if you're using them to condemn a whole society, I think you're missing a lot.

[Gregg]

Who gets to decide what is "fair share" and what is "greed".

Kind of my point. There is no need to decide. Rather than talking about "shares" why can't we add a little more depth to one of this group's buzzwords: enough. If a resource has the potential to be virtually unlimited, as it could be with opportunity of all kinds, then why does anyone need to care if someone else has more or less? In the Africa analogy no antelope is harmed because an elephant drinks more than it does because it still has enough.

There's nothing inherently wrong with someone having more of anything than someone else. The problems arise when that something is necessary for quality of life, or even life itself. We are fortunate to live in a dynamic society where wealth and opportunity can be created at any time. To raise the floor there isn't any need to grab chunks of the ceiling*. Considering that the upper socioeconomic levels are where the ownership of assets can be found there is fantastic opportunity available to those who provide opportunity to their workforce. No better way I know of to increase profitability than to educate your workers (problem solving and innovation in-house), help them get healthier (less sick time, lower healthcare/insurance costs), keep them happy and feeling secure about their prospects (retention, less training, recruitment & legal issues), etc. But that's a long term investment strategy, it will rarely produce the most dramatic quarterly results.



*Want to do away with income inequality? If the average boss makes 200 times what the average worker does, increase the average worker's wage by 4X. Then the gap is only 50 times. Oversimplified yes, but not necessarily wrong.

[catherine]

I think you're being unfair to "our culture" (if such a thing exists). I have served in uniform with good people willing to endure everything from inconvenience and indignity to mortal danger to protect their country, and they weren't in it for the money. I work every day with people who chose public service over the maximum paycheck. My daughter's school exists because families are willing to make the financial and time sacrifices needed to provide the best education they can. I serve on the board of directors of an organization that builds houses for families that might not otherwise afford one (nobody involved is getting rich, I'll tell you that). This board you're posting on gives the lie to the concept of greed as a virtue.

Are there people who prioritize material gain? Sure. Let them. Everyone should have a right to chart his own course and live with the consequences. But if you're using them to condemn a whole society, I think you're missing a lot.

I don't mean to condemn the people.. I really don't. I like people! What I object to is the system (political/media/corporatocracy) that only works by "encouraging" people to want more, buy more, aspire to more while we kill the planet and incur vast inequalities in the process.