Misconception: Minimalists don't care about people.

[Ultralight]

I had a conversation last night with my girlfriend about sentimental stuff.

The discussion was not about my stuff or her stuff, but about how her half-sister (and many other people in the world) deal with sentimental stuff. Her half-sister's mom died a few years back. Half-sis was left the house and all the belongings in it. Half-sis could not bring herself to sell the house, so she rented it out. The renters have nearly destroyed it. All the stuff went into a storage unit or was absorbed into half-sis's household. The trashy renters and the storage units and the new clutter in half-sis's home caused a lot of headaches for her, her husband, her kids, etc. Not to mention the financial costs...

The discussion got intense -- not an argument, but emphatic on both my part and my girlfriend's part. I told my girlfriend that I would not hold onto all that stuff if someone close to me died. She said: "I know you wouldn't! You aren't close to people or emotional about people. You can just cut people out of your life like they never mattered. You're a minimalist."

Now this... This right right here is a major pet peeve of mine: The misconception that minimalists don't care about people and/because we don't care much about their "stuff."

Any other minimalists, "right-sizers," or SLers deal with this misconception?

[SteveinMN]

I can't say I have encountered the misconception. I certainly may be less sentimental about "stuff" than many other people (GF's half-sister, for instance). And I could see that that comes off as less caring about people. But one of the reasons I chose to live simply was to be able to spend more time on people than stuff.

There are many people who really don't engage as much with people around them. How much of that is cultural or even gender-related I can't say. I think your GF is coming to an incorrect conclusion based on existing facts.

[catherine]

I think you were just pushing her buttons and she became defensive. That's another whole question, though.. a relationship one, and none of my business.

I don't see any correlation between minimalism and hard-heartedness. Was Jesus hard hearted? Buddha? Tolstoy? St. Frances? Mother Teresa? Sorry about the religious references--I DO know who I'm speaking with here , but the point is, these people were NOT known for being hard-hearted, and you could also describe them all as "extreme minimalists." The whole idea of minimalism is to keep material distractions at bay so you have more TIME for more meaningful, deeper relationships. You discard THINGS so you can embrace PEOPLE, and I do believe that is a driving force for many minimalists--certainly not all, though. I wouldn't want to generalize.

[Ultralight]

I think you were just pushing her buttons and she became defensive. That's another whole question, though.. none of my business.

I don't see any correlation between minimalism and hard-heartedness. Was Jesus hard hearted? Buddha? Tolstoy? St. Frances? Mother Teresa? Sorry about the religious references--I DO know who I'm speaking with here , but the point is, these people were NOT known for being hard-hearted, and you could also describe them all as "extreme minimalists." The whole idea of minimalism is to keep material distractions at bay so you have more TIME for more meaningful, deeper relationships. You discard THINGS so you can embrace PEOPLE, and I do believe that is a driving force for many minimalists--certainly not all, though. I wouldn't want to generalize.

catherine: Despite my ardent anti-theism I am incredibly intrigued by the minimalist lifestyles of Jesus, Buddha, St. Frances, and even Mother Teresa. Gandhi too (minus the creepy stuff).

You might be right about her being defensive, though the conversation didn't really become intense until she said that. I explained to her that when I lay down for the big sleep that I'd certainly want all my stuff donated promptly. I tried to explain that I care about people and not so much about things. I said caring little for stuff means I can invest so much more in people -- like my involvement in the Recovering From Religion and Life After Belief support groups or the environmental groups and community groups I take part in. I'd rather spend time helping a friend cope with coming out as Atheist to his family and friends than spend time shopping at a mall or sorting through my collection of widgets.

[catherine]

I explained to her that when I lay down for the big sleep that I'd certainly want all my stuff donated promptly.

I've said this in these forums before, maybe pre-dating your joining, but my mother became a minimalist when Fate stepped in and she lost everything she owned--home, belongings, health, relationship. She was 50 at the time. When she died, my brothers and I stopped by her room at an assisted living place and put her clothes in one plastic bag and donated them, and put the few belongings she had (photographs of us, mainly) in a cardboard box, and that is now stored at my brother's house. That was it. Her estate. She did us a great favor by leaving the world so lightly. Her legacy was in her kindness, cheerfulness, generosity and unconditional love.

There were no fights among siblings over who gets the painting and who gets the silver. There were no wrenching decisions about having to get rid of stuff there's no room for. I kept her watch and a rain slicker she had gotten 2nd hand from a friend. There really wasn't that much else to keep.

You're on the right track!

[Ultralight]

She did us a great favor by leaving the world so lightly. Her legacy was in her kindness, cheerfulness, generosity and unconditional love.

A legacy cannot get any better than this!

[jp1]

It's possible that half sister (and possibly also your GF) equate stuff with people. Not that stuff is people, but that it's a direct physical manifestation of the deceased person (or living person). My first BF had an assortment of things that had been his mother's and grandmother's. His apartment was jammed with it (but very clean and neatly organized.) All that stuff gave him a sense of still being close to his mother and grandmother, both when they just lived in another state and later after they had both passed away. It was like he literally felt his grandmother's presence every time he sat in her ugly living room chair that she had sat in for many many years. Had he not passed away as well I'm sure he would've kept that stuff for decades.

[Ultralight]

It's possible that half sister (and possibly also your GF) equate stuff with people. Not that stuff is people, but that it's a direct physical manifestation of the deceased person (or living person). My first BF had an assortment of things that had been his mother's and grandmother's. His apartment was jammed with it (but very clean and neatly organized.) All that stuff gave him a sense of still being close to his mother and grandmother, both when they just lived in another state and later after they had both passed away. It was like he literally felt his grandmother's presence every time he sat in her ugly living room chair that she had sat in for many many years. Had he not passed away as well I'm sure he would've kept that stuff for decades.

jp1:

I think that is probably the case, at least partly. Though half-sis's inherited house was in WI and she lived in GA since her early 20s. So she was not in the house often. And the majority of the stuff was in storage, maybe still is. I am not sure.

What I think you are referring to is an incredibly hard thing for most people to deal with: A person is not their stuff.

[Kestra]

Interesting questions.
I haven't had much feedback about minimalism as it doesn't really affect my friends/family that much. But people do seem to think it can impede dating - no car, no real bed, no sofa, no own place, etc. But I think it is fine for the right person. I don't want those other people anyhow. I actually make a point of bringing up my minimalism to any men who I see dating potential with. So far they've all also been people who practice minimalism in some capacity, or have in the past, or are at least interested in it. If I ever have the minimalist conversation with a man who is completely the opposite, I'll let you know how it goes.

For death and relatives, I think my family generally agrees that the best gift you can give your children is to get rid of most of your stuff before you go. My will specifically indicates to either donate or sell all my stuff. Anyone I'm giving anything to needs the cash more than boring household stuff. None of my mementos will mean anything to anyone else.

I think the bigger relationship stumbling block is the frugality. People see you as cheap and uncaring if you don't give gifts. They also think it's hard to date frugally. I disagree. But I do have an amount of money I plan to spend each month on social activities. I'd rather do cheap ones but paying is necessary for some things.

I think spending time with people is more important than money. Generally people who disagree just aren't in my life that much.

[jp1]

jp1:

I think that is probably the case, at least partly. Though half-sis's inherited house was in WI and she lived in GA since her early 20s. So she was not in the house often. And the majority of the stuff was in storage, maybe still is. I am not sure.

What I think you are referring to is an incredibly hard thing for most people to deal with: A person is not their stuff.

Thank goodness I don't have this issue. By the time my dad passed away the only stuff he had left was all really old and not noteworthy in any way. I can't imagine having spent money to bring it to San Francisco and then have to deal with it crowding our place up. We have plenty of stuff of our own. The few exceptions, such as my mother's cedar chest that she kept some family heirlooms in, are now in our home. When I look at the cedar chest, though, I don't think "wow. that represents mom." I think, "gosh, that's a nice chest. I hope the cats never get the urge to scratch it..."