If they cut social security and medicare

[iris lilies]

Well, unauthorized immigrants ARE criminals, technically speaking. So that would be ALL illegal immigrants are criminals. They are breaking an immigration law. Some people put weight on that technicality, some don’t.

I am one who puts weight on it.

[Rogar]

Well, unauthorized immigrants ARE criminals, technically speaking. So that would be ALL illegal immigrants are criminals. They are breaking an immigration law. Some people put weight on that technicality, some don’t.

I am one who puts weight on it.

What would you propose as a solution?

[Tradd]

I love Terry Savage. She’s my fave financial guru. Talking about recession today in her column and on the radio.

https://www.terrysavage.com/recession/

I’m not taking any vacations this year except maybe a regional diving weekend. Stashing cash. Cancelled 401K contributions for a bit to pile up more cash.

[iris lilies]

What would you propose as a solution?

There is not “a “solution. And why you expect me to solve it is beyond me.
However, these are the efforts that interest me:

some deportation as is now taking place, more than in the previous administration, is one tactic.


The big loud anti-illegal immigration message coming from the White House has been effective in naturally reducing the number of illegal immigrants who cross the border — illegally. the numbers being reported are the lowest in a decade.

I don’t understand why the programs for temporary low skilled workers haven’t been expanded because we need those workers. So, I would like to know more about that, but think an expansion of the number of people let into our country legally to pick strawberries would be a good thing. Americans are not gonna pick their own strawberries.

Reduce the number of Temporary Documents handed out, if I understand that program correctly. I don’t see that as a conflict with the above, but perhaps I don’t understand the two different programs.

I would like to talk about what services illegal immigrants are given in our country. After that conversation I might not want to see any changes but I sure would like to know more about taxpayer dollars going to those who are here illegally. I don’t understand how those with illegal work papers are contributing to Social Security, etc., and I would like to understand that. If you’re undocumented, how do you contribute to Social Security? Yet we’re told time and time again that they do contribute to the system. I don’t understand that.

[early morning]

They contribute to the system because they are working with fake or stolen documents, sometimes set up by employers. The SS taxes are taken from their wages and reported under the fake or stolen SS number. So - money in. But the worker can't draw SS, because they would likely be discovered as using fake docs at that point. So, no money out. Or money going in is credited to someone's real account, so they, not the actual worker, are credited with the money paid in. So, yes, they contribute to the system with no expectation of ever drawing from it. People working under the table do not pay into the system, whether they are illegal or not.

[Rogar]

I do not understand the benefits that people living here illegally receive, either.

I don't think deporting those here illegally, if it's the numbers are truly 10 or 15 million, is possible, practical or economic. Which is the only thing on Trump's table right now and another of his fantasies. In my opinion, the only solution is to somehow provide a legal alternative to some or all of these people either by a better system of work permits, exceptions, or a path to citizenship. It's not just the strawberry pickers, but college students, families who have lived here for more than one generation, and skilled professionals. The fault probably goes back a few presidents and has only gotten worse because of some sort of political grid lock or partisan quibbling. I don't see any solution being proposed right now that is even close to addressing the multitudes of "criminals" living here.

Denver's mayor along with the other mayors of sanctuary cities are before congress as we speak and there will probably be a summary to peruse. One of the mayors said that if government truly wants to make America safe, stop cutting Medicaid, VA funds, cancer research, and focus on gun reform. I suspect they are being verbally abused by Boebert, Greene, and Jordan who all have a talent for twisting the facts and will accuse them of illegally harboring illegal immigrants. The mayors will claim they are following Federal and state laws and merely not providing assistance to the Feds to enforce federal law. There is probably certaininstances of EO's not superseding state or local laws and I can picture it ending up in courts, as things go these days.

[Tradd]

Reagan’s amnesty for illegals in the 80s just kicked the can down the road.

[flowerseverywhere]

Thanks for taking the time to back up my observation that no one has said that "all illegals from Mexico are murderers and rapists". I'm sure if it had actually been said it would show up in your research somewhere.

Of course there are multiple examples of murderers and rapists among the millions of illegal immigrants in the country and saying so doesn't mean that "all" fit that description. Claiming otherwise is simply propaganda.

thank goodness. Because it’s ok to say they are eating pets, killing citizens en masse, are coming from jails and mental institutions I guess.

[iris lilies]

They contribute to the system because they are working with fake or stolen documents, sometimes set up by employers. The SS taxes are taken from their wages and reported under the fake or stolen SS number. So - money in. But the worker can't draw SS, because they would likely be discovered as using fake docs at that point. So, no money out. Or money going in is credited to someone's real account, so they, not the actual worker, are credited with the money paid in. So, yes, they contribute to the system with no expectation of ever drawing from it. People working under the table do not pay into the system, whether they are illegal or not.

I figured there was a lot of under the table work going on, but it’s shocking to me that false documents are so plentiful.

and if there’s so many of these illegal workers paying into Social Security accounts that are not their own, what do the citizens think who see this money coming into their account and it’s not their contributions? I can’t grab that. Also, you would think there are ways to run software to identify some of these accounts that are reporting to full-time jobs. Or maybe the false documents are mostly on dead people and those Social Security contributions are going into dead people’s accounts, never to be claimed.

But I also don’t understand why, if a illegal immigrant is successfully using a dead person’s Social Security account for many years he doesn’t claim the benefits. I can’t help but think some of these benefits are claimed.

[Tybee]

Well, unauthorized immigrants ARE criminals, technically speaking. So that would be ALL illegal immigrants are criminals. They are breaking an immigration law. Some people put weight on that technicality, some don’t.

I am one who puts weight on it.

Actually, under your argument, only some unauthorized immigrants are criminals. To enter illegally is considered a crime. If they entered legally and overstayed, which according to a 2006 study was 45% of this population, then it is a civil and not a criminal matter:

"[COLOR=var(--appr-color-text-primary)]Many foreign nationals, however, enter the country legally every day on valid work or travel visas, and end up overstaying for a variety of reasons.[/COLOR][COLOR=var(--appr-color-text-primary)]But that’s not a violation of federal criminal law – it’s a civil violation that gets handled in immigration court proceedings."[/COLOR]

Are undocumented immigrants committing a crime? Not necessarily | CNN Politics