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Thread: The War Against Youth (article in Esquire)

  1. #21
    Senior Member flowerseverywhere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoebird View Post
    Fascinating article in Esquire magazine that shows who is really behaving like an entitled brats!

    For a while now, people under 35 have been regularly accused in the media and political forums about being 'entitled' or feeling 'entitled.'

    But this article points out some interesting information about who really is entitled -- boomers.
    I read the article and I saw no suggestions to make things better than sit around and fume. I was distracted by the first line you wrote about "brats."

    The system is not right, I think we will all agree. Generation after generation of politicians of both parties have not been good stewards of our money, that I think we will all agree. We have trodden down a path of unfunded wars, ridiculous amounts of money being lent for houses and education at ridiculous interest rates, and an ever increasing life expectancy. Many boomers are suffering as well, as they have been downsized and outsourced- many seniors have no hope of retiring and there are many in the middle, too young for medicare and they cannot find a job with health benefits or cannot afford the policies. Although I am told my SS benefits won't be touched because I am too old don't think for one minute I believe it. I truly believe that going forward the benefits will be slowly chipped away in little ways (cost of living increases, tax rules etc.) and by the time you are in your sixties there is no more time to make it up, even if you can get a job. This is kind of like a keg of powder waiting for the fuse to be lit.

    So we have two choices. We can try to figure out who are the victims (then what are we supposed to do) or we can band together and try to change the system which is clearly broken.

    I vote for the latter.

    So how can we change the system to benefit us all?
    Last edited by flowerseverywhere; 4-4-12 at 9:25am.

  2. #22
    Senior Member jp1's Avatar
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    When there are a limited number of resources it's necessary to allocate them to their most productive uses. In the past all resources were much more scarce. Even food and water were once potentially scarce items. Today our scarce resource is simply money. The bottom line, is it more productive and useful for a society to spend $100,000 providing a college education to a young person who can then go out and get a good job and be part of helping the economy grow, or is it better to spend $100,000 on an organ transplant operation for an 80 year old retiree? If we have $200,000 to spend then great, we can afford both. The problem is that we don't have $200,000. And currently we're spending that $100,000 on the organ transplant and maybe $20,000 on the education.

  3. #23
    Helper Gregg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggy View Post
    This is an age old argument. I'll bet you'd be surprised to find that we boomers blamed OUR parents generation for all the country's ills.
    Exactly. That was the basis of my question to Zoebird; to see if her generation was looking to come up with their own version of 1968. That was a pivotal year for boomers. I suspect that if her generation is going to do anything it would look more like a social media driven Arab Spring than the protests of 44 years ago, but that would not change the validity of a movement.

    The feeling I have, and this is only a gut feeling, is that there is a decided shift away from engagement in the younger generations. It's not across the board, but I just don't see or hear about a real upswing in the involvement of Gens X and Y. Those generations seem passive which, given the energy of youth, is sad. The boomers were, if nothing else, very energetic and engaged in their youth. They fought and rallied in HUGE numbers against segregation and war, went back to the land, had a sexual revolution, gave the world whole new classes of literature and music and drugs, completely shook up the political process in the US, changed the college experience forever and on and on. It wasn't necessarily all positive, no movement guided by youth with no experience would be, but it was certainly passionate. I just don't see a passion like that or that kind of energy from Gens X & Y. Am I missing it? Maybe I'm looking in the wrong places, but what I see is more and more examples like the article Zoebird posted that just claim victimization, but offer no solution. I don't believe they are victims of any more than their own way of thinking, but even if they are the only way to break free is to get up and DO something about it. Is there a plan of action in the works?

    ETA: To be clear, what I see as disengaged is in NO way saying the younger generations are slackers. I don't think they are. The two concepts are simply not related. OTOH, it is not the same as being disenfranchised. There could be a relationship if it is shown that X&Y really are disenfranchised, but that is yet to be determined.
    Last edited by Gregg; 4-4-12 at 10:16am.

  4. #24
    Senior Member bae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gregg View Post
    Is there a plan of action in the works?
    Apparently the plan is to not-so-subtly threaten people...


    By bus and train and car pool, they will follow the gerontocracy to Tampa and Charlotte, the cities with the utter misfortune of hosting the presidential nominating conventions. Then we'll see if the people inside the convention centers can find the youth anything better to do.

    We'll see then how the flowers of rage, planted and nurtured so carelessly for three decades, have sprung up and who will harvest them.

  5. #25
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    Is there a plan of action in the works?
    Gregg, I don't think my generation is disengaged. I will be 34 this year, so I am on the older end of that generation. For one thing, I think the internet has drastically changed the way people get their message heard. It's a more efficient method of reaching a wider audience than protesting, which really doesn't garner the same kind of attention it seemed to once-upon-a-time. Media is changing. It's not so much about attracting the attention of the mainstream media outlets, which requires a big "to-do" that gives them something to chew on and show pictures of. A lot of people spread the word about their causes via social networking and YouTube. You can get more people to watch your viral YouTube video than you could ever get to witness your actual demonstration and you aren't relying on mainstream media outlets to fairly and accurately report on your activities. You have more control of the message.

    What I have observed from my generation and younger people is that we tend to feel like government, at least at the federal level, is largely beyond our sphere of influence. It's like this big faceless entity and it seems like, for the most part, people get elected by selling their soul to someone. Which someone that is varies by party and person, but it takes a lot of money to get a dog in that fight.

    Because of that, and because of the changes the internet has brought about, I see a lot of younger people trying to "be the change" as they say. It may not be loud and boisterous, but it's something. I know a whole lot of young people who are approaching their life and decision making with a lot of consciousness and deliberately making decisions they hope will, in some way, create a better future from the ground up.

    That said, I don't feel like a victim. Things are hard, yes, but that's been true most of human history. It might have been nice to side-step it, but it is what it is and it could certainly be worse. When I start to feel bad about what we face, I try to think of what life was like for my various ancestors, like what it was like for my pioneer ancestors to brave these Minnesota winters with none of our modern conveniences, or the Jewish great-grandparents from Germany I know nothing about because they had to leave their baby with strangers and hope he'd find a better life someday. Whatever life deals me, I'll make the best of it.
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  6. #26
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    The feeling I have, and this is only a gut feeling, is that there is a decided shift away from engagement in the younger generations. It's not across the board, but I just don't see or hear about a real upswing in the involvement of Gens X and Y.
    Um the revolution will not be televised. Your not going to hear about anything via the mainstream media, it is completly corrupt. But what I think the case is is those that are involved are involved and those that are not, aren't. Was it ever different? Even in 1969? My involvement is mostly just community, don't look for a revolution from this weary tired gen Xer (but ocaassional resistence? ). There are a lot of things that mitigate against say an uprising on a college campus these days say. I bet young people today on average work more hours while going to school than boomers did for instance. But still things like tuition hikes do get protested, and well they should. There are a lot more things that mitigate against a protest at the political conventions, mostly that it is illegal (possibly with up to a years jail sentence) and protest is only allowed miles from any convention. I think the legal environment is harsher than it was. Also another thing that interferes with it is the mainstream media these days is horrible, so many people are not informed about anything. But the truth is out there on the net.

    I just don't see a passion like that or that kind of energy from Gens X & Y. Am I missing it?
    Well generation X is a bit apathetic, I've never really related to that entirely though I'm an Xer (for one things my parents had kids very late in life - I don't relate to the generations most gen X parents came from - I"m a kid of a WWII gen and a silent gen). I relate more to those a few years younger (gen Y), who seem very community oriented. I like that. I don't really know many millenials, those fresh out of school now. By the way if it's true that less and less young people are getting cars these days (prefering bikes, walking, public transport) that that would be a bit of a revolution after all.
    Last edited by ApatheticNoMore; 4-4-12 at 11:44am.
    Trees don't grow on money

  7. #27
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    I know a whole lot of young people who are approaching their life and decision making with a lot of consciousness and deliberately making decisions they hope will, in some way, create a better future from the ground up.
    I like to base my opinions about these things on what I see around me. I work at a graduate school and see first hand the passion this age group (23-30ish) has for changing their world for the better. The are involved and committed. I also see that many of them have had very comfortable lives due to their boomer parent's hard work. I would like to think we live in a society where we all look out for and respect each other regardless of age. I find myself thinking often that I would now like to slow down and let the younger generation take the reins offering advice when asked. It will be their world soon enough.

  8. #28
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    As a gen Xer I feel it never was and never will be our world really. We're always just a shadow, just in between like some invisible middle child, never even mentioned in articles apparently, the jobs we want will always be taken first by boomers who had "more experience" and soon enough by younger people as we become "too old" (40 and up you know is "too old" to work! - and too young for most to retire).
    Trees don't grow on money

  9. #29
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    Well, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not an avid user of social media, but it does make absolute sense to me that any new revolution will be broadcast that way ala the Arab Spring. Hopefully we can avoid the violence. I'm happy and relieved to hear there is a wider consciousness regarding the impact of our life on others and presumably on the planet as well. It's obviously time for me, and more people in my generation, to start paying more attention to 'alternative' sources of information. Suggestions welcome.

    Stella, I promise that the notion of a Federal Government that has grown beyond citizen influence is not limited to your generation. I'm a tail end baby boomer and have felt that way for a long time. That, and the conjoined fiscal issues, is what steers me down a (moderately) conservative path. To be honest the Tea Party really had my interest in the beginning when their emphasis was smaller, more transparent and more responsible government. They've since picked up a lot of folks with social baggage that I do not share, but the original message was intriguing precisely because so many people feel disenfranchised from the government.

    Maybe the most logical question we boomers can ask you up and comers is: what kind of world would you like to see? Then: what do you guys need? Closely followed by: what can we do to help?

  10. #30
    Senior Member mira's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bae View Post
    It's just another way of dividing us all against each other.

    I'm wondering though, should I expect violence from Gen X/Y/Zers when I go to the convention?
    Hey, if you wanna take this outside, let's take it outside!

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