Bae, just curious. Did they die while fighting a fire?
Bae, just curious. Did they die while fighting a fire?
That's a piece of the World Trade Center. One of our firefighters drove out to NYC to pick it up and bring it back here a few years ago, where we have set up a memorial at our main station. We had a memorial service there this morning to remember The 343, and the other victims.Originally Posted by AnneM
This isn't a peeve, it's a big sad thing. Maybe we should have an ongoing thread about large, sad, things that happen.
I don't feel right posting my rant about--well, whatever. It's always some dumb little thing that I quack on about, not in the same league as the 9/11 memorial things.
OK, I'll say it.
September 11, 2001, was an important day in American history. Many lives were lost tragically. I can only imagine the pain of having kissed your loved one goodbye in the morning and never seeing them alive again.
However, in the U.S. each year, ten times as many people die in auto accidents; ten times as many die of suicide; twice that many died fighting the "War on Terror". Each of those deaths left behind bereaved families and dreams cut short. Yet those deaths get nowhere near the news coverage and Facebook posts or tweets and millions of dollars spent on memorials and shrines that September 11 gets. And then there's what our collective reaction to the events back in 2001 have done to our civil liberties and our ability to travel and conduct business freely.
I understand (from having lived there) that the reactions of people in New York, Washington, Boston, and Pennsylvania are somewhat/largely cultural. I understand the particular investment of those families in which individuals died. But I think people wrapping themselves in the flag and in marginally-shared sacrifice for September11thedaythatchangedeverything give it way too much emphasis. Why don't people change their Facebook profile pictures for Pearl Harbor Day? That, too, commemorates an attack on U.S. soil and thousands of lives lost.
July 4, September 17 -- those are days which should define America. I hate to see us define ourselves by 9/11. It's a victim's mentality. America is better than that. Remembering is good. Remembering is important. But for a society to hollow itself with paranoia and false patriotism in the face of much bigger challenges to our way of life ... just seems a terrible waste.
Alright, the Nomex suit is on....
Success is to be measured not so much by the position that one has reached in life as by the obstacles which he has overcome. - Booker T. Washington
Steve, You articulated my feelings so well. When I see "never forget" on cars with Confederate Flags...well, it just rubs me the wrong way. The pseudo patriotism pushed during the wars made me ill. But, I think we are in the minority . I certainly do not want to dismiss the pain people still feel. It never goes away. But that is true for all tragedies, nationwide or personal.
Steve - that photo I posted is of a memorial, at my fire station. Where I wear a Nomex suit almost every day. It is in memory of firefighters who died trying to help people. False patriotism?
So, ...........
False Patriotism?
Why do you get to define someone else's feelings and emotions? Are your eyes the only ones that see the truth and your views the only ones worthy of respect? Must I, or anyone else, meet your approval on the anniversary of a day that changed our lives?
I don't want to speculate, but I'm guessing you've never taken an oath to protect and defend, to place others safety and security above your own, to remember the face of evil so that you'll recognize it the next time. to honor the victims of that evil. If not, how can you judge what you don't understand?
By what reasoning can you assume anyone's patriotism false?
"Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein
I knew that post would draw conversation from certain quarters ...
bae, how long has that memorial been at your fire station? Is there a reason a chunk of the World Trade Center figures prominently? Are the losses of those firefighters' lives more worth commemorating than those of any other firefighters'? Why don't I see old guys wearing baseball caps labeled "Remember Seattle's Bravest"? Surely Seattle has lost firefighters in the course of duty. What about them and the losses of their families?
I have no problem commemorating the service of firefighters, police officers, and members of the military. They deserve commemoration. What I'm pointing out is that, for some reason, there are damn few public monuments to firefighters and police officers who've died over the course of the decades but a shower of coverage every September 11th for those specific people. I don't see red/white/blue ribbons on the back of cars and trucks urging us to "never forget" the state troopers who died when drunks ran into their patrol car during a traffic stop. Why does 9/11 get singled out so much? Yes, they were doing their job. So were all the other first responders everywhere, on September 10 and April 23 and December 25. As I said, I deny them nothing. I just want to know why the 9/11 responders seem so ... "anointed".
Alan, I can define patriotism just as ably as you can. Or anyone else can. Patriotism is not reserved for those who have served on front lines. And false patriotism is out there. It's that nonsense about questioning one's devotion to country in not wearing a flag lapel pin. It's implying that those who have not taken oaths to protect and defend are somehow less patriotic than those of us who have. It's in not challenging authority when authority clearly has its own agenda. Is it unpatriotic to suggest that something is afoot when Obama wants to lead a "surgical" strike in Syria despite the reticence of a vast majority of the American people and the international community? Was it unpatriotic to challenge the garbage evidence that Bush 43's regime provided when he wanted to invade a country that had nothing to do with 9/11? Why is it that it was "patriotic" to go shopping after 9/11 but not to take concrete steps to reduce American dependence on oil from these dictatorships -- like imposing a carbon tax? Why is it still considered unpatriotic to suggest that blank checks written on behalf of armed forces budgets and the shredding of the Constitution by the NSA and FISA could stand a little reasonable examination? Why are people so upset about Snowden but not about the massive amount of spying on American citizens which he exposed and which was categorically denied by those perpetrating it? Why doesn't December 7 get the press every year that 9/11 does? How was that different?
Patriotism is not just "my country, right or wrong" or "if you don't like it, leave". Unfortunately, that's where things have been headed for a long time. That's false patriotism. Putting a "remember our troops" sticker on the back of your single-occupant SUV for your 40-mile commute to work very often (note use of the qualifier) is false patriotism. Flag waving without discussing and embarking on a change of course to fix the problem is just making noise.
Success is to be measured not so much by the position that one has reached in life as by the obstacles which he has overcome. - Booker T. Washington
So, the term 'false patriotism' is simply projection? That's fine with me if it is, everyone is entitled to their own thoughts and beliefs but I reserve the right to reject the label.
You can feel free to write it off as a peeve, from 'certain quarters'.
"Things should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler." ~ Albert Einstein
Years now. The piece of steel was given to our department by FDNY, and one of our members drove across the country to bring it back here.
Yes, it is a memorial to those who died in that particular incident. Which was the single highest casualty incident for firefighters in US history. It stands out, both for the statistics, and for the particulars of the day. We still go over some of the lessons learned every week in training. It's...important.Is there a reason a chunk of the World Trade Center figures prominently?
Not particularly. But you make the incorrect assumption that we do not honor those others.Are the losses of those firefighters' lives more worth commemorating than those of any other firefighters'?
Indeed Seattle has. We talk about them pretty often around the station, several perished in tricky ways that we'd all like to avoid, and their names come up in training. As to their families, you may be unaware of the large behind-the-scenes fraternal efforts that exist for mutual aid....Surely Seattle has lost firefighters in the course of duty. What about them and the losses of their families?
The monument I posted a picture of, while technically a "public" monument, is inside our station, built by firefighters, paid for by firefighters, and meant for firefighters and their families. There are several such memorials in our stations. There's a whole hall of them at the state fire academy...What I'm pointing out is that, for some reason, there are damn few public monuments to firefighters and police officers who've died over the course of the decades but a shower of coverage every September 11th for those specific people.
Good day.
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