Iris lilies, how are things in your hood?

[JaneV2.0]

...

Jane........here's some more of my "oft-stated" stuff. (It has always seemed to bother you the most around here). I think one problem we're all having here is that all of us have, like I just said to Rob, such a variety of different experiences. Some of live in the middle of all sorts of cultures and people who get along. Some of us have had mostly bad experiences with certain types/cultures of people. Of course not everyone in different groups is going to be the same. I think it's pretty natural, if a person sees a certain type of behavior in a certain group of people over and over......there are going to be some generalizations made.
We should all strive for and hope for a peaceful co-existence with everyone. But sometimes people live around a skewed representation of certain types, and it would be naive to not acknowledge that.
I'm happy for you that you live in a place where everyone is happy and reasonable. But not everyone lives in a place like that. And it sounds like you're talking about, and interacting with very bright people from different cultures. That is quite different from the people I'm referring to in some of what I've said. Plus........as I said, I was trying to understand why some things might lead to some problems in cultures.

Of course everyone here isn't happy or reasonable. But in my many years of life, by far the most disagreements I've had--99.8% or so--have been with WASPs and I imagine that's true for you, too. Hmmm. Except for my SO, come to think of it. Maybe you have a point! I think the main problem--if any--we have in integrating different cultures is fear and suspicion of the "other." As people get to know each other, those problems are usually resolved.

[dmc]

To be fair, I'm betting that this has not been a pleasant experience for him at all and he probably did not foresee all this happening after the shooting. I don't feel sympathy per se but I can see where this officer's life is never going to be the same again - supposing that there is no indictment, how safe is he? How could he realistically just stroll into the Ferguson police department and assume his prior duties as if nothing happened? Plus we don't know what kind of emotional scars he now bears due to fallout he probably thought he was immune from or didn't even think of in the first place. I truly wish this officer had never met up with Michael Brown to begin with but maybe, maybe, maybe, the good to come out of this will be some social change? There is a bill being drafted right now by a Democrat from Georgia in regards to reigning in the militarization of the police, for example. At least some unpleasant issues are on the table receiving proper international attention. Rob

Maybe, even after being attacked by Michael Brown, and then after Brown came back at him, even though he was in fear of being killed himself, he still feels bad about having to take a life.

I wish Michael Brown wasn't a thug.

[LDAHL]

To me this is different, very different. The police have power over us, carry guns, can arrest us and hassle us, and therefore I hold them to a higher standard. In Ferguson they have not only failed my standard, but many other people's, too, and it will be interesting to see how much money transfers via lawsuits against the Ferguson police department - and overreaching officers from local police departments that stopped by to "help". Rob

It seems to me that the only difference is your hostility to a particular group. Punishing one person for another's crime, under any circumstance, is not the sort of policy a civilized society should want to adopt.

[ApatheticNoMore]

I hold positions that are unpopular, would you not agree with that?

Not necessarily. I suspect people that may agree with you to some degree are staying away from this thread (as being way too hot to handle and even getting personal). I can't say that I blame them.

The little that I can do is to provide some kind of illumination as to why people would react the way that they did in Ferguson

I think that's pretty obvious and was instantly, they react to a perceived pattern of police brutality and abuse in this country and locally (because it's not like the Brown thing just came out of a vacuum, and there were no other cases). So they may judge a bit quickly for this particular case, but honestly the other side is just as guilty of that, and it's completely and utterly obvious (to everyone but themselves). As each piece of new information got out from the incident (yes there is still some missing), people were quick to tout whatever agreed with them.

[bae]

Maybe, even after being attacked by Michael Brown, and then after Brown came back at him, even though he was in fear of being killed himself, he still feels bad about having to take a life.

If it played out as an assault/self-defense situation, even if *none* of this other business was playing out, it's serious business for the officer. It's not an easy thing to take a life, or suffer through an assault on your own life. Often there is counseling needed.

I've had two people die this year while my hands were crushing their bones and violently assaulting them (while trying to save them), and been intimately involved in several other deaths (as in, I had to decontaminate my clothing...). Each time, my department required mandatory counseling and mental health awareness checks to make sure those involved weren't having too hard a time moving forward with it.

Rob though wants to punish everyone in the officer's department, and have them move forward living in fear and terror if anyone steps out of line, as judged by Rob's Mob and the Twitterverse. I think we should instead just eliminate police forces entirely, and usher in a new era of healthy community spirit and peace.

[creaker]

It seems to me that the only difference is your hostility to a particular group. Punishing one person for another's crime, under any circumstance, is not the sort of policy a civilized society should want to adopt.

But isn't that exactly what people do when they lump "them", "those people", whatever into a single group? It seemed a lot of that also happened during the protests. NYPD has made it a working policy.

There is good and bad everywhere - and I think when anyone ignores the realities of either side of that, it creates problems.

[gimmethesimplelife]

Maybe, even after being attacked by Michael Brown, and then after Brown came back at him, even though he was in fear of being killed himself, he still feels bad about having to take a life.

I wish Michael Brown wasn't a thug.

See what I mean about auto-siding with the police? We don't know all the facts yet as others have posted. Flip this around to auto-side against the police and it could be my post.

I do agree with you that Michael Brown was a thug, regardless of what I think about the police or the courts. He was no innocent angel for sure. Rob

[dmc]

See what I mean about auto-siding with the police? We don't know all the facts yet as others have posted. Flip this around to auto-side against the police and it could be my post.

I do agree with you that Michael Brown was a thug, regardless of what I think about the police or the courts. He was no innocent angel for sure. Rob

I'm willing to wait for the facts to come out. You have seamed to have already made up your mind. But I will admit I tend to side with the police story. It's much more believable that Michael Brown attacked the officer than the other way around. What did the officer have to gain for shooting him? Brown had just robbed a store, as you say a known thug.

Do you believe that the officer was trying to pull a 300lb man thru the window or is it more likely that Brown was attacking him and reaching for his gun?

[Alan]

I'm willing to wait for the facts to come out. You have seamed to have already made up your mind. But I will admit I tend to side with the police story. It's much more believable that Michael Brown attacked the officer than the other way around. What did the officer have to gain for shooting him? Brown had just robbed a store, as you say a known thug.

Do you believe that the officer was trying to pull a 300lb man thru the window or is it more likely that Brown was attacking him and reaching for his gun?

Agreed, but I'm an Occams Razor kinda guy without an axe to grind.

[bae]

Agreed, but I'm an Occams Razor kinda guy without an axe to grind.

Alan, I'm shocked! I might have a spare I can loan you!